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August 09, 2014


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North Miami Beach most definitely has an eruv. Also, Miami Beach is a very "rich" area. North Miami Beach is more working/professional class. Very different neighborhood (I lived there for 4 years).

Fleishike Kishke

There's a $50,000 reward for info leading to these lowlifes. Someone will come forward. I hope.


FK: Joseph's blood may be crying out for justice, but I wouldn't count on justice anytime soon. The reality is that American central cities rank high when it comes to murders per 100,000 in first world countries. In most cases, both the victim and the perp are black. If it is any consolation, murder rates in the US have declined since the early 1990's when David Dinkins was mayor of New York and an Australian rabbinical student was shot to death in Brooklyn. Economist Steven Levitt gives much of the credit for the decline in the US murder rate to Roe v. Wade, the abortion case. Read here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Impact_of_Legalized_Abortion_on_Crime#Donohue_and_Levitt_study

Fleishike Kishke

"Yes quite a few frum yidden carry a gun on Shabbos." Interesting. No wonder the conversation went to gun politics even before burial. NMB does not sound like a tropical paradise.


Yes quite a few frum yidden carry a gun on Shabbos. I am one of them and several rabbonim have said it is permissible in nmb. The Eruv covers the area.

Fleishike Kishke

As far as I've heard, Raksin family members are hardworking, gainfully employed and overall 'guys guys.' They are Lubavitchers, so they wear the beard and hat, but (smicha not-withstanding) I'm not sure about Yosef being a 'rabbi.' He may have been a salesman for a kosher vitamin company. He was in south Florida to visit his child and grandchildren. I can't imagine he went out on shabbos morning looking for a fight. He was on summer vacation and likely looking forward to lunch with his family, and enjoying being out of Brooklyn. I'll bet Yosef was PRO responsible gun ownership (you boorish rightwing wackos). But even if Yosef owned a gun, he likely wouldn't carry it on his Sabbath. He must have ascribed special holiness and divine protection to his Sabbath. The killing of this gentle man by unknown gun-toting assailants is the worst the United States has to offer. I would hope law enforcement promptly catches and lawfully executes his killers. Every breath they draw shames law enforcement in the state of Florida and the whole USA. Joseph's innocent blood cries out for justice.

(The other) Eli

Orthodox Jews are not going to carry guns on Shabbatot. This isn't the time or place to talk about the merits or consequences of gun control

Yahoshua David

"USA didn't let them in, they were kidnapped or bought to be slaves."

Any proof of this?

Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law

Jekyll has a very good point. It's one thing to be packing heat; it's another thing to be trained and proficient in the use of said heat.

I assuming that the perps were quite familiar with the use of a firearm; therefore, I don't think it's inaccurate to state that even if this rabbi had been armed, that it would have done him any good. In an unfamiliar environment, suddenly confronted with a threatening circumstance, and being inexperienced with a weapon...I don't think it would have ended any better than what is being reported.

In a situation like that...just give them your wallet or whatever. Wallets can be replaced. People can't.


If he had a gun he wouldn't have been carrying because he didn't rely of the eruv, do this is a debate of a moot point.


The problem is that people flinch or hesitate to shoot -- that's when the perp gains the upper hand.

Posted by: Jekyll Jacobson | August 10, 2014 at 07:17 AM

yeah right. a 60 year old man would have had a chance against two young men who were armed, even if he didn't 'flinch'

Jekyll Jacobson

Packing heat and being aware of your surroundings + being a fast shot = better chances of survival than an unarmed person. The problem is that people flinch or hesitate to shoot -- that's when the perp gains the upper hand.

Abe Foxman

Diversity is our strength.

this is a name

slogans don't win gun fights, training does win gun fights. sadly, there is always the possibility of the "sucker punch" but having a gun is still better than being forced to give your money to a thief. In states where no guns are allowed, all criminal acts are "suckerpunches."


USA didn't let them in, they were kidnapped or bought to be slaves.

Yahoshua David

That's exactly like asking why are there so many killers in Israel. They both let in un-assilables who the vast majority have trouble integrating into a completely foreign culture. Hashem didnt create all nations to live together - see tower of babel as proof.


This country spawns such monsters similar to the isis in iraq,2 young black man an almost everyday occurance why are there so mamy killers in this country i would like an answer.

Yahoshua David

One fled on bike.. Sounds like a spur of the moment thing happened.

You cant let ego and pride get the better of you. No one has a right to mouth off or provoke someone without suffering the consequences. In the US anyone could have a gun. Especially certain profiles of people which is obvious.

But as far as black kids shooting and killing someone because their jews??? Lol they must be angry at CNN?? Lol that's ridiculous. This is what i mean about ego and pride. The world doesn't revolve around us. Not everything that happens is because of antisemitisim. It's not good for your soul if you believe everyone is against you and outisers. Its what cults do actually.


To rephrase my question: Does an eruv allow you to carry ANYTHING you want?


More than likely, it was a crime of opportunity. Two young black males see an elderly white man walking alone and figure he is an easy mark. Such crimes normally happen at night, so it is a surprise to me that he was murdered during the day.

When I was mugged over 43 years ago, the perps were also young black males. Fortunately, I did not put up a struggle and all I lost in the robbery was my wallet with all of $8 in it. But it was a major hassle replacing ID cards etc and I was traumatized for weeks thereafter.

In spite of the fact that US big city crimes, especially murders, have come down from their early 1990's peak, they still remain a problem in urban areas in or near poor neighborhoods.

If you want to be an urban hipster, you may end up getting more than you bargained for, and not in a good way.



Part of North Miami Beach does have an Eruv. The murder apparently occurred within the Eruv. See link to Eruv map.



Would an Orthodox Jew carry a gun to shul on Shabbat, even with an Eruv?

(I doubt North Miami Beach has an Eruv. The City of Miami Beach - a separate and non-contiguous municipality - does have an Eruv.)


if the rabbi had a gun u coulda had 2 less thugs in the world then and there.

Posted by: this is a name | August 09, 2014 at 09:45 PM

Not very likely. A few weeks ago here in Phoenix, some ne'er-do-well armed with a crowbar entered a Catholic church planning to rob the pushke equivalent and steal whatever else looked valuable. He was confronted by two priests, one of whom pulled a gun. The criminal grabbed the gun and shot the two priests. One died, and the other was seriously injured. Do you think a random elderly Jew walking home from shul would do any better than the armed priest (and that presumes that there was an eruv and the random elderly Jew held by the eruv).

Further when I was in Las Vegas a few weeks ago, two far right wing-nuts (who had been thrown out of the Cliven Bundy demonstrations for being too crazy) decided to foment a revolution. Armed to the teeth, they entered a pizzeria and shot two cops (also armed and trained in the use of firearms) while they were eating lunch. The would-be revolutionaries then went across the street to a Walmart, and brandished their weapons (they took the guns and ammo off the bodies of the dead cops). A shopper pulled his gun, and the two wing-nuts shot him dead (lotta good his gun did him). Finally police entered the store and killed the revolutionaries. So five armed people, five dead people.

Packing heat may well make you less safe, not more safe, as the priest and the shopper would tell you if they weren't dead.


To "you" & to" this is a name-calling" if there were no guns then the perp wouldn't of had a done this crime. If you own a gun you are more likely to get shot - ban all guns like in Canada & in countries in Europe and these things wouldn't happen or at least a lot less. I like how people say the word "liberals" like it's something negative, "live and let live and don't judge other people - Ban the guns-


@ this is a name....many shuls in Miami Beach have armed security guards, and many members of the frum community are armed. Also, don't think that having a gun always wins....it's a mindset that goes with having the gun, or the thugs will get the jump. Slogans don't win gun fights.

Office of the Chief Rabbi

There was better coverage on the Miami Herald website. For example, the shul was Bais Menachem.

this is a name

if the rabbi had a gun u coulda had 2 less thugs in the world then and there.


For every Jew, a .22 - or you can die like an unarmed liberal bitch.


What a horrible tragedy. May he rest in eternal peace and may the murderers be soon brought to justice.

this is a name

i'll bet this rabbi was against guns.

this sad murder is a practical application of when seconds count, police are minutes away.


Terrible. Cops say no sign of a hate crime. Yeah, right.

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