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July 14, 2013


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Alter Kocker (great hash by the way). I am not religious. There is no video. There was abuse. Has this article been accurate, a lot of parents would have taken their kids out yesterday. Anyway, what's with the anger? Are there Jews that are covering up abuse? Definitely! Are all Jews? No! The incident was horrible enough without Shmarya adding his own spin. Remember, many religious have kids as well, and they don't want them abused. My point was that this article was incorrect and inaccurate. If Shmarya really stands behind this information, why is there no source? Plain and Simple he made up a story either to get views (which worked) or to slander the camp. MM, I am not a lawyer, and I'm scared of them. That being said, there are definitely lawyers involved. The issue is that the article (and alleged does not help) states that Camp Dora Golding tried to help a child molester flee the country. They can only sue for the source I am told, and if it was in fact made up and not based on the facts of "A person intimately (bad word) familiar with the case." I repeat, I am all for torturing child moles tors. However, we need camps and schools, and that is where these sickos hang out. If the Camp found out about a molestation, they should have called the police (which they claim to have done. You may be right regarding the legal jargon; I don't know. There are many parents that were furious at the camp, now E-mailing the above article to Alex Gold. Let's see what happens. Interesting that this "Video" never surfaced. I was hoping it would so we have solid proof.


"... this made up article is what we call slander." I don't know who "we" is, but no lawyer would call this slander. Slander refers only to defamatory statements made orally. If a defamatory statement is made in writing, that is called libel.

A plaintiff in order to win a libel suit must prove "actual malice" on the part of the defendant; that is, the defendant must know that the statement is false at the time of publication, or that the defendant had "reckless disregard" for the truth (that is, had serious doubts). "Actual malice" here does not involve ill intent. Therefore allegations that Mr. Rosenberg is "always out to get Orthodox Jews" would be irrelevant.

I doubt very much whether lawyers would be rushing to file a libel suit against Mr. Rosenberg here, because I suspect that it would be impossible to prove that Mr. Rosenberg published anything he believed to be false or about which he had serious doubts. The information may in the end turn out to be inaccurate or false after investigation, but if Mr. Rosenberg cannot be proven to have known it was false (or at least very very sketchy) when he published, then he cannot be held liable for libel.

So, Jimmy, all of this talk about calling lawyers (or being lawyers) who are preparing to file suit is very dubious. If people did rouse lawyers over the weekend foaming at the mouth to sue, they were likely told "Fugedaboutit." And if any lawyer characterized this as slander, he or she should turn in his or her license to practice law on the grounds of incompetence.

Alter Kocker

PS to Jimmy-First time posters bother me more. If you are frum, you are shitting your pants that there is video of this in the hands of the police. That is incontrovertible evidence. You can bet that the defense in this matter will attempt to have it thrown out. Once again, you trolling pieces of shit, you want to apologize for the severely disturbed among you that can't control themselves and take to sexually abusing children. You'd sooner have them diddling the kids than let the world know that there is a problem in the community. Saving face at the expense of the weakest among us is quickly becoming the earmark of the orthodox jewish community.


Sorry if my previous quote bothered some of you. Lawyers offices are not open, but many parents in the camp are lawyers looking to make some money or at least get in the news. I am not a "Frumma" as some of you believe, just a friend of a family in the camp. The original news article really scared all the parents, and the camp should have responded faster. However, Shmarya in another attempt to stab the people that he feels turned on him, (see his auto biography on Wikipedia) got some "Sources" that changed the story. According to him the camp tried covering it up, that is 100% not true. The camp called the police, not parents as this article claims. There was nothing videotaped. However, this joke of an article really scared some innocent mothers. The camp does have the right to obtain his "Source" and using the word Alleged does not save him from getting sued. I'm all for putting pedos in jail for life, and I have no shame in ripping into the so-called Rabbis that molests the kids. However to fabricate a story to cause other harm is unacceptable. Incidentally, although the original story was picked up by many news outlets, they all had the common sense to stay away from this one. Parents are not as smart and believed it to be true. Shmarya - not all Jews believe in what Chabad does. A lot of us are OK people just working to survive. You are going after the wrong people.

Eli, what me messiah?

I love how VoT tries to take Shmarya to task for using the adverb "allgedly" and now Jimmy claims he's committed slander.
But of whom? The counselor was arrested, and FM just reported it. No Orr names here except the camp, and FM asks whether it followed procedure or aided his flight.
Yeah, I'd like to see the facts come out in that suit. But I'm guessing the camp doesn't.

WoolSilkCotton; I must be seen to be believed

Jimmy, you are totally full of shit. What lawyer's office is open on the weekend? And how did your imaginary lawyers already decide what Shmarya has to prove? Doesn't the plaintiff have to prove that Shmarya broke the law, and not the other way around?

Funny how frumma love threatening people with lawyers.


Wow Failed Messiah. Let's just say I have had my doubts about your posts before, but this just takes the cake. I think it's the too many "allegedly"s that give you away. I know the exact sequence of events and the entire reporting was done efficiently and by the book. As soon as is humanly possible, the child was protected and the offender was handed over to authorities. Both from a Jewish and American legal standpoint, they covered their bases. It's amazing how your blog will report questionable and in many cases fictitious reports simply for the shock factor. Not sure where all your rage is coming from, but it is certainly misdirected . It is apparent that you are no longer a news reporting, whistle-blowing entity. You downgraded yourself to a sensationalist tabloid. You lost my respect......



Tell them to bring it on.


Here are the facts. The camp did call the police, and this made up article is what we call slander. It was shown to the staff at Camp Dora Golding, and they are in touch with their lawyers. Apparently, Mr. Shmarya Rosenberg has issues with Orthodox Jews and feels the need to exaggerate any story that comes his way. However, he may have bit off more than he can chew here. According to the lawyers, he would need to prove that he was informed of the above from a reliable source or risk a massive lawsuit. I'll keep everyone posted.


CDG has been covering up abuse for years... nothing new! there was a staff member L.F. who was abusing kids so they just made him Alex G's assistant. Wonder what he assisted with;)


The old way to tell is to get the 911 and local police records to see who called and when .......also, WHO posted bail? Mug shot? Etc..... There's alot of info that we all don't know now......

Shmarya Can you call the local police and get that info for us please?


Devorah? Why are you jumping to conclusions?
What makes you think the camp tried to cover it up? Any specific reports or evidence?


I just read the letter too. Seems like it should have gone out sooner. Considering it was three plus days in coming it was mediocre but all things considered there will probably never be a perfect letter on that subject.
Overall, the turn-around time on these types of events is improving tremendously esp in the modern orthodox community machmir or not..


We always turn to FailedMessiah for the latest news on scandals. But I am very wary of this posting.

It is clear, the camp was not equipped with the proper know how on issuing press releases or notifying the parents. It seems camps have that problem, as evidenced with the tragedy in California, in which the camp (Jewish in name only) did not tell the children that a counselor had died in a freak accident, when a tree fell on the dining hall.

According to the Pocono News, the police arrived on Thursday afternoon. It seems unlikely the camp would have had a ticket ready for him. It also seems unlikely that the parents called the police and not the camp. If this story is true, the camp could have sent the police away and told them nothing happened.

It seems that even though the camp has not handled this well from an outside point of view, they should be commended for taking action and calling the police immediately. I think in this case Failed Messiah is doing a great disservice, and is preying on the camp's lack of savy, rather than waiting until all the facts are known.


I just received an official communication from the camp.
To sum up - an established protocol was followed. The administration was immediately notified, steps were taken to safeguard the camper, the accused staff member was prevented from leaving camp, the facts were verified, the parents of the camper and the authorities were notified. Within a few hours the staff member was arrested. Support and counseling is being made available. Staff are trained to deal with this sort of issue during orientation and protocol was followed quickly and properly.
Camp has a zero tolerance policy for over a decade.
If further info becomes available it will be shared if you have any concerns contact the camp.

Grizzly - It seems the camp called the police. I don't know anything about tickets and neither do you. I am not going to repeat the three versions I heard because it is likely none of them are completely accurate.


For the record the girls' camp is mostly modern orthodox machmir (campers) but the campers at the boys' camp are definitely not modern orthodox machmir any more than they are (modern orthodox) liberal. One really unique thing about the place was that there was quite a mix... lots of sheitels and lots of pants (on women oy vey!) on visiting day.The staff not so much...lots of Yeshivish counselors and the only married Rebbeim and their families I ever saw were VERY Yeshivish.
Not that any of this matters regarding the issue at hand I just mention it because that was noted in the article.


"You make it seem as if it is terrible that the issue was reported by parents and not by administrators,"

Yep. That is terrible. If the parents hadn't gone to the police, we would not be reading about this at all. Were the administrators too busy trying to erase evidence to call the police? Why weren't all the parents informed immediately? Get your kids -------> if you're smart. But then again, you'll probably blame the victim and not the abuser or your kids would already be home. Another poster claims the "OTD brats are all on drugs."

I'd send my kids to a camp like this, lol. (not)


JP. This incident occurred late Wednesday nights. Its 4 days so since. ...... We are waiting for A) Dora golding to officially come out and tell their side... Who called the police? And why/if tickets were purchased. BEFORe the police arrived at. 440pm on Thursday.

JP - what 3 rumors have you heard?


Frigjoo excretes:

"Dora Golding has been taking in campers that are on all types of medication. It wouldn't surprise me if this whole story was made up by the camper. The camp doesn't even allow the kids to have recording devices anyway. I know boys that are counselors there the past few years. The camp treats their staff like crap and the campers can do no wrong."
Right on schedule and by the script:
I know these guys. They're absolute saints. These OTD brats are all on drugs. They made it all up, the little mosers. The video doesn't exist.

And I suppose the police faked the video because they're all antisemites who just want a chance to persecute an ehrlicher yid.

Don't you have any fucking shame Friggin' Joo?


The problem with this story is that neither Shmarya nor Devorah knows that there is or was a cover up, nor do they know any of the facts of the case other than the short article that was published, but have already taken a de facto stance that there was a cover up.
I am a parent of a camper, and since Friday, I have heard three different versions of what happened, but none of them mentioned that the camp tried to help the accused flee the country. What makes your source more reliable?!
I am rather dismayed that the camp has not been more communicative, but after emailing the camp I received an immediate response. There is no denial or cover up. I was assured that the entire parent body will be receiving more information. You make it seem as if it is terrible that the issue was reported by parents and not by administrators, but you also reported that the video was not even in the administration's possession, but in a camper's possession. The video will not be turned over for a few more days - is that a cover up? I don't know the facts of the case yet, but neither do you. Is it possible a parent made the report and not the camp because the parent was informed first?
My scenario may be inaccurate, but we don't yet know the exact sequence of events.
You make one unsubstantiated allegation (you didn't even mention how your source came to the knowledge they claimed to have - parent? counselor? administrator?) and all of a sudden it is fact.

WoolSilkCotton; I must be seen to be believed

++VoiceoftruthOf | July 14, 2013 at 03:29 PM++

Nowadays, all you frumma have left, before you are put in prison for all your filthy deeds, is the word 'allegedly'.

Hang on to it for as long as you can, VoT. Soon it will be replaced by 'convicted'.


Dora Golding has been taking in campers that are on all types of medication. It wouldn't surprise me if this whole story was made up by the camper. The camp doesn't even allow the kids to have recording devices anyway. I know boys that are counselors there the past few years. The camp treats their staff like crap and the campers can do no wrong.


"My kids are in camp too and I have yet to hear ONE SINGLE WORD from the camp!!! They call me as soon as one of my kids sleeps through davening, but are totally non-communicative when it comes to this VERY SERIOUS issue?? How do you "know exactly what happened"?"

If this were my kids, they'd be out of there already. If there is ONE pedophile, there could be more and the victims may not always have videos. What kind of parent allows kids to stay at Camp Dora Golding knowing the camp is involved in a cover up???


a Press release from Camp Dora Golding is in order! What's with the silence?


So Modern Orthodox is in the same league as the ultra-Orthodox when it comes to child abuse. Really sad. So who's left on the Orthodox side that cares about children?


Really, sad mom??? My kids are in camp too and I have yet to hear ONE SINGLE WORD from the camp!!! They call me as soon as one of my kids sleeps through davening, but are totally non-communicative when it comes to this VERY SERIOUS issue?? How do you "know exactly what happened"?


two very important allegations...

"What’s more, the alleged abuse – which, Failedmessiah.com was told, was surreptitiously videoed by a young camper who was suspicious of the counselor’s actions – was reported to police by a parent, not by camp officials, officials who also failed to tell the alleged victim’s parents about the alleged abuse, the source claimed."

a) If this was reported by the parents and not by the camp then SHAME on Dora Golding....

b) There's a VIDEO of the act! filmed by a camper????? wow!


If he was arrested by U.S. authorities and his passport confiscated so he cannot return home to Canada, how do you know the camp tried to help him escape?

sad mom

this poor boy.... I know Exactly what happened because I am a mother of a boy in camp....you are ruining the life of a kid who you don't know what he did or did not do ....and it is erev Tishabov!!!!!what a disgrace!!!

Bas Melech

Seems like charedim have a network to aid "alleged" criminals escape the justice system.


FYI- Respected journalists use the words "alleged" and "accused" because the individual suspected of the crime has not yet been charged and found guilty and to avoid libel.

Read secular newspapers and listen to secular news broadcasts, and you will hear the word used.


VoiceoftruthOf-To me you sound like you are deathly afraid of theese stories most probably you are a molester youreself, or covering up for one.


@ never frum, anyran
Would any well respected journalist or reporter ever put their name on an article written accusing an organization or person of something and base those accusations strictly on hearsay from an anonymous source without anything more then just that alone as proof of the story.


VoiceoftruthOf, do you even know what the word "journalism" means? He's saying "allegedly" to tell you these are allegations that haven't been proven in Court.


Are you an idiot? These are "allegations" right now....they then go through the justice system and these "allegations" are proven either to be true or not true ("allegedly" is from the same word as "allegations"...you could try google translate to translate my post to yiddish if this will help you understand). By Shmarya writing that these are allegations, it does not detract from his credibility as a journalist even a little but you are on other hand have shown what a schmuck you are.


Apologist to the left. Fund raisers in the middle and concerned Yids to the right.

This should create some order. Sad!



How don't You feel stupid calling yourself a journalist with integrity when almost every one of your bullshit posts have at least 2-3 times the words "allegedly" in them, without anything actually backing it up

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We thank Mr. Rosenberg for his efforts on behalf of the Jewish Community


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