Borough Park Store Offers Gender-Separate Shopping Hours For Yeshiva Students

A Borough Park store offers separate single-gender shopping hours for unmarried haredi yeshiva students.

Comments

[David]

G-d forbid that mixed shopping might lead to mixed dancing - and we know where that leads....

[Aztecqueen2000.blogspot.com]

I was predicting this about a year ago. When elements of dystopia become reality, there's a problem.

[RWisler]

But most unmarried boys of yeshiva age are more attracted to each other (and act on it)than they are to the Beis Yaakov girls. At least that's how it was in the 1970's and 80's at Chaim Berlin.

[jancsibacsi]

The more religious someone is like in chassidim the more mentally disturbed he becomes extreeme in anything is evil but theese bozos cannot comprehend that since their minds are so stuffed up with toireh learning and domination it becomes reality to them, evil is good by them, and good is evil perverts.

[seymour]

this is what happens when a community and its leaders fail to confront their extremist.

the extremest will become the norm

[Reuven]

Those who can not handle lusting after the opposite sex in a store should buy online... Oh yeah.. that won't work either as the internet is full of cats and members of the opposite sex. sigh...

[WoolSilkCotton; I must be seen to be believed]

Reuven, LOL, the #1 danger on the internet these days is all the silly pictures and videos of cats.

[Gevezener Chusid]

Personally I would also prefer to do my underwear and nightshirt (that is one of the things on the list) shopping without the Chassidishe mammelech and their twin strollers with six toddlers in the store. But I do most of my shopping online. (As I have 2 actual cats, I don't think the internet presents a problem for me.)

[Gevezener Chusid]

RWisler from Chaim Berlin - were studies done to see whether homosexual activity was more prevalent among boys than among girls, are you speaking from personal experience, or is your posting more of your usual incomparable flatulent rant?

[Sarek]

This cannot possibly be legal anywhere in the U.S., especially in NYC.

Anyway, if a man goes during man hours, would he be allowed to purchase women's clothing? (or vice versa?)

[Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law]

@Reuven- as a dedicated cat lover, I'm not sure I agree that the number one danger on the Internet are the cat videos and cat pictures!

I think the danger that the cat videos and cat pictures present is that people spend so much time watching them, they slack off from work!

[Voice of Truth]

I'm not sure who an why would any one be bothered by this. It doesn't seen to be hurting anyone, the store owner is happy to serve his customers with their convenience in mind and the customers are happy to shop at a store that caters to them. So big deal if there are no women in the store while shopping where's the harm in that to anyone especially if everyone walks away happy.
Now lets see how creative you all can be with coming up with BS childish like excuses as to where the "real" harm is

[seymour]

This cannot possibly be legal anywhere in the U.S., especially in NYC.

Anyway, if a man goes during man hours, would he be allowed to purchase women's clothing? (or vice versa?)

Posted by: Sarek | June 19, 2013 at 12:17 PM

PRIVATE STORE MOST LIKELY LEGAL

[Yochanan Lavie]

Why are people hating on cat videos? Do you think it's un-tzneeyusdik to look at pussies?

[jancsibacsi]

Voice of Truth--The real harm is when someone like you doesnt see the obvious its a no brainer,this is what the rebbi and toireh brings to the young male it implies that the young yeshivish have no self control they are not to be trusted aroung woman or girls,but you with youre superior wisdom cannot see the obvious, too much toireh learning brings on anesthesized brains.

[Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law]

@Voice of Truth: Now lets see how creative you all can be with coming up with BS childish like excuses as to where the "real" harm is

Voice, let's just suppose that the Store Owner, instead of having separate hours for Men and Women, had separate hours for Whites and Blacks. Or, separate hours for Jews and Non-Jews. The rationale being that "well...some groups don't want to mix with other groups, and I'm just accommodating my shoppers".

If you can't see that there is no difference in the underlying bigotry between separating and accommodating separation based upon gender, the same way such bigotry is on display when we separate by race....then frankly, I think someone failed to teach you 1) basic morality and 2) the difference between right and wrong.

I suspect that someone also failed to teach you that people who are a different race, creed, color, national origin, or religious belief as yourself should be treated with the same dignity and respect that you would treat a carbon copy of yourself.

But frankly, from what I have seen and learned of the haredim both here in the US, and in Israel...tolerance of, and respect for, those that are different than the haredim....does not seem to be high on the priority list. If it's on there at all.

[dh]

If a male shops on women's day, but nobody sees him, was he really there?

[Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law]

@seymour: PRIVATE STORE MOST LIKELY LEGAL

No, it's not. Back in either the 1950's or 1960's, the Supreme Court held that private establishments could not discriminate based on race, due (from what I recall) to the effect on interstate commerce. I don't recall all the details of that lines of cases, but I can virtually assure you that gender-based separation/discrimination is not legal.

[Sarek]

@Seymour and @VoT - See Robert J. Barron's comments.

Not only illegal but immoral.

[Steven W]

@ Robert J. Baron:

Katzenbach v. McClung, 379 US 294 (1964). Civil Rights Act applied to Ollie's Barbeque via the Commerce Clause prohibiting segregation in public places such as stores and restaurants because some of the restaurant's purchases came through interstate commerce.

[Steven W]

See also, Heart of Atlanta Motel v. US, 379 US 241 (1964). Civil Rights Act of 1964 via Commerce Clause prohibits discrimination in public places of accommodation.

[Hashtin_al_Hakir]

Marketing ploy, that's all. Just like sex sells, in these communities, frum sells.

[Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law]

@Steven W, Yup, those were the ones I was thinking of...but my Constitutional Law class was a LONG time ago!

[Bas Melech]

VoT-
Doesn't all your Torah learning and tzitzit protect you from aveirah in a public place?

Why is it that you men have a problem today, when in the past there wasn't one when men and women shopped at the same store at the same time?

[Bas Melech]

Also, don't bachurim go shopping with their mothers?

[Reese]

It's absolutely amazing the complete lack of self control of these people. I have witnessed ultra-Orthodox from school boys to their tatis literally staring at the slightest exposed skin on a female on the street and in stores. It's like they cannot actually believe and get enough of what they are seeing.

Their girls on the other hand stare at the men and then give back a dirty look if they are caught.

[Bas Melech]

Reese,
They must be curious about what the other side looks like even basically.

[Voice of Truth]

@ I'm not exactly sure what your point is
@ Robert. There is a difference between separating whites and blacks Jews and non Jews etc then from separating boys from girls simply because in this particular case that is what both sides want as opposed to the aforementioned case.
@ bas melech it's called b' dika darka achrina

[Robert J. Barron, Attorney-at-Law]

@Voice "There is a difference between separating whites and blacks Jews and non Jews etc then from separating boys from girls simply because in this particular case that is what both sides want as opposed to the aforementioned case."

Ummm...no, theres' not. There are plenty of whites, who, in this day and age, still do not want to mix with blacks. Most of them are elderly whites, but still..there are still white people who do not believe in mixing the races.

And there are still other people (usually the same who don't believe in mixing races) who don't want to mix with "our" kind, either.

But then again, since I suspect you have not been taught the difference between right and wrong, and/or that ANY kind of discrimination and segregation is immoral, not to mention illegal...I don't suspect that you really understand what I am saying.

But let me make this analogy- if you see how the haredim treat women (both here and in Israel) and then you read some American History and see how whites treated blacks back, say, in the Jim Crow years, you'll see very few differences. (Well, the haredim don't lynch women, I'll give them that)

Both White Supremacists and Haredim believe in the strict segregation of races and sexes. The White Supremacists do so because of their deeply-held belief that the black race is inferior. The Haredim because they believe that men are inherently superior to women.