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February 28, 2013

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Durga`s Son

If only the Burn Again Christian "Zionists" really knew how Judaism regards them.

Abracadabra

YL - Great post. Very interesting and informative.

Russian PhD

The Jewish guy did ask the Arab if he could borrow the Arabs tractor to plow half of the Arabs field for himself. The Arab didn't agree...

If somebody will come into Brooklyn grocery shop owned by a Hasidic Jew and will ask him (kindly) to give half of the shop (and its goods and income from it) to him-should the Hasidic Jew agree?

meir

this settler meshchist is such a lunatic. I feel bad for the arab farmer...intersting the arab farmers look like such decent people.

Yochanan Lavie

Balderdash: happy to oblige!

Ben; Good idea to study Islam, yashar koach. In order to understand the world, it's important to know what motivates people. And I hope you realize that I don't condone Islamic extremism.

Jake: You're right about Islam, particularly mainstream Sunni Islam. Interestingly though, Franz Rosenzweig and his contemporary disciple David Goldman (Spengler) think Christianity is closer to us. The reasoning is that Christianity and Judaism are covenantal religions and a covenant is a two-way reciprocal binding agreement that limits both sides with certain obligations. Hence Avraham Aveinu and Moshe Rabbeinu could occasionally argue with God, as did Menachem Mendel of Kotsk and others.

Islam, in Rosenzweig's reading, is not a covenantal religion. There are no checks on Allah's power, so he can do whatever he wants, as arbitrarily as he wishes. We can only submit to his will (Islam does mean submission, and Muslims are those who submit). In this interpretation, Allah is a monotheistic deity who has taken on all the capriciousness of all the pagan gods, such as Hubal, the moon god worshiped at Mecca (Islam co-opted Mecca as well as the crescent moon symbol, as you know). Is more monolotry than monotheism.

I think Rosenzweig is partially correct. Shia Islam, as well as extreme Sunnism (such as the Wahabis and Salafis) exemplify what R was talking about. However, the more rationalist Sunni schools, as well as the mystical Sufis, are more open to a dialogue with God. The harsh stuff in the Quran and Hadith are usually historically contextualized and/or allegorized by them. (Much as some Modern Orthodox Jews do with the harsh stuff in the Miqra, Midrashim, and Talmud).

Unfortunately, thanks to oil money and politics, the intolerant schools of Islam are ascendent. We have seen this before in the Middle Ages. When mild Islam flourished, Muslims were open to science, the arts, and Greek philosophy. When fundies such as the Almohades took control, libraries were burnt and Jews were persecuted (Rambam fled Cordova because of the fundamentalist Almohades). That is why Islamic civilization declined and the West overtook it. The West opened up at precisely the same time Islam was shutting down.

The same thing happened to Chinese civilization. At its innovative peak, the Chinese had four masted ocean-going vessels that were far more comfortable than Columbus's leaky caravels. Soon thereafter, a new emperor was afraid that foreign contact would dilute his country's Chineseness, and set fire to these ships. Building a ship of more than one mast became a capital crime. China declined, the West absorbed its technology (as it did with Islam) and the rest is history.

Now, fundamentalist Judaism is triumphant. Are we to believe that we are exempt from a similar fate?

DJ

This dude has BIG BAYTZIM.

Jake

Jesus is a lowly prophet in Islam.
Islam is also a messianic religion like Christianty and Judaism.

Judaism and Islam are Eastern religions that have far more in common with each other theologically then Judaism has with Christianty.

The video was very interesting. The Jewish guy did ask the Arab if he could borrow the Arabs tractor to plow half of the Arabs field for himself. The Arab didn't agree and has lived for another day.

Lo K'darkah

Arrogance leads to exile. Historians of the future take note...

chugibugi

Shmaryah,you are right,i am sorry,i realize i crossed a line,won't do it again,

Bob Guthrie

Posted by: Avi
"That's what I call peaceful dialogue!."

Uh, no. A dialogue is a (normally civilized) exchange of ideas and opinions between two or more people (Webster).

This is a one way Extremist Religious herald about these Arab's future slave/indenture prospects, with veiled warnings if failing to comply or submit.

Well, okay, it's then a "Extremist Chareidim Dialogue", when phrased this way. =/

Mike

funny, I was just reading up on Roman history and the failed Bar Kochba revolt against Hadrian, led by another nut who kept telling everyone about Moshiach this, Moshiach that.

Looks like history does indeed repeat itself, a modern successful nation being destroyed internally by a religious and zealous minority

http://www.livius.org/ja-jn/jewish_wars/jwar07.html

Perhaps the funniest comment out of ancient sources;

"At this time, the Jews started a war because they were forbidden to mutilate their genitals."
- Historia Augusta, Hadrian

Bob Guthrie

Posted by: chugibugi
"How many times to we have to tell you,..."

What do you mean "We", Kemosabe?. No, I'm pretty sure you are the only card carrying member on you large, perceived posse of stupid, bubbeh.

Abu Jihad Schneerson

Ben,Jesus is DEFINITELY the Messiah in the Koran!And could you name your sources that Jews won't be able to convert to Islam?

Ben

Abu Jihad S, this is what I also thought, and was surprised to find out that the Jews would not be able to convert, but will have to be killed according to the most islamic "scholars"

Russian PhD, Jesus (Isa) is not a messiah in Islam, he is a prophet and a minor prophet at that. Moses (Musa), David (Daud), Solomon (Suleiman), Itzhak and Abraham (Ibrahim) are also respected islamic prophets. For some reason this does not stop Imams from calling to genocide of all the Jews. Go figure.

Abu Jihad Schneerson

Hi,jancsibacsi I know frummies are sometimes lunatics.
What a shanda this guy is!

Avi

Posted by: Russian PhD | February 28, 2013 at 03:56 PM

I guess Russian Phd's aren't worth much.

Shmarya

uncsibacsi. how many times to we have to tell you,this blog is for grown ups only,no stupid hasid wannabe atheists allowed in here,
please go back to CHEDER,and tell your mommy to wipe your snotty nose,you really sound stupid trying to sound like an intellectual,when it is pretty obvious you are nothing but an ignorant hasidic drop out

Posted by: chugibugi | February 28, 2013 at 03:52 PM


Here's the deal.

You do not determine who is and who is not welcome here.

If you do it again or do anything else even remotely understood to be threatening, I'll delete your comments.

Russian PhD

Ben:

“This guy has a very humane and liberal ideology. He promises a muslim Arab benign slavery when his Mashiakh comes”

Please put more attention to what he says: these who DESERVE it will be our slaves. I guess the non-deserving will be killed.

“Muslim Arabs on the other hand promise Jews complete and total genocide when their mashiakh comes”

I am not buig expert in Islam, but according to what I know Jesus (Joshua) from Nazaret is a messiah accoring to Islam, as well. So, Muslims have Jewish messiah-will they kill all Jews when he will come?

chugibugi

Juncsibacsi. how many times to we have to tell you,this blog is for grown ups only,no stupid hasid wannabe atheists allowed in here,
please go back to CHEDER,and tell your mommy to wipe your snotty nose,you really sound stupid trying to sound like an intellectual,when it is pretty obvious you are nothing but an ignorant hasidic drop out

Winston Smith in ILSOC

The whole squabble in this video is pointless. It is a property dispute and should be decided in court. That's it. It appears that the so called Yechi guy is just grabbing the land(or at least half of it) and using religion as a pretext...more than likely because the Yishuv of Tapuach would not give or let him use land withing the Yishuv. In an ideal world, they could make an agreement of use of the land for mutual benefit. The messiah can sort it out later.

jancsibacsi

Abu Jihad Schneerson-HELLO ABU MY FRIEND,TRAGICALLY THEESE FRUMMIES TURNED OUT TO BE MENTAL CASES, A MIND IS A TERRIBLE THING TO WASTE.

Abu Jihad Schneerson

Ben,if you've studied Islam you surely know that for a Jew hiding behind a tree or rock to avoid being killed it is enough to convert to Islam,which takes less than 2 minutes.On the other hand,converting to orthodox Judaism becomes harder and harder every day,and won't be possible in the Mashiahnic era.

balderdash

to yoch lavie: thanks for the chuckle. never heard it before so thanks,spot on.

Ben

YL, you are right about Wrights.

It is always good to keep things in perspective though. I've decided to study Islam and have done it as much as possible in the last 3-4 years. It is amazing in how many ways islamic fundamentalists are similar to haredim. However, they have much more violent ideology and much greater aims.

Just wanted to point out that the bunch of quiet Arab Muslim farmers on the other side of the Jewish crazy have an ideology of genocide and only waiting for an opening to implement it.

Yochanan Lavie

Ben: Two wrongs don't make a right (but 2 Wrights make an airplane).

Yosef ben Matitya

Ben | February 28, 2013 at 12:22 PM

silly me, all the while, I thought we are better, it turns out, we are at best worse as we claim to be better educated. alas no more, our religious leader are against education.

Ben

This guy has a very humane and liberal ideology. He promises a muslim Arab benign slavery when his Mashiakh comes.

Muslim Arabs on the other hand promise Jews complete and total genocide when their mashiakh comes.

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews , when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Muslims, O Abdullah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him "

Sarek

Thanks YL. I can't control my inner Allan Sherman.

Dovid

Larry is not actually blind or stupid, he's just a blatant liar who failed to notice a clear piece of evidence that everyone can see, and which proves him a blatant liar.

On the other hand maybe he is stupid, because he expects us to believe that someone wearing a Yehi yarmulke is not a meshichist!

Yochanan Lavie

Sarek is on a (challah) roll.

Sarek

("The End of the World", Skeeter Davis (Kent/Dee) )

Why do the Arabs go on living
Why does Hashem let them live
Don’t they know at the end of the world
Mashiach will make them captive.

Why should the Arabs keep on farming
Why does the sun light their crop
Don’t they know at the end of the world
Mashiach will put them in a sweatshop

I daven every morning and I wonder
When God will smite those who aren’t us
I can’t understand, no, I can’t understand
Why others make such a fuss

Why do their hearts go on beating
Why do they make others to cry
Don’t they know at the end of the world
Hashem will make others say goodbye

Don’t they know at the end of the world
Hashem will make you say goodbye

Atheodox Jew

Most people who believe in this kind of messianic triumphalist dogma at least have enough good sense to keep the idea to themselves.

But to say straight to someone's face that "if you behave well you'll get to be my slave" is so grotesquely narcissistic and sadistic it's hard to even put into words!

On the other hand, if we have teachings which are too offensive or preposterous to say out loud, are these things we really want to believe in?

Sholom

Wow, Larry. Wow!

Great logic there, Gemorokup.

He's wearing the Yarmulka that meshichists wear, and that only meshichists wear, but he's not a meshichist.

Shoyteh.

Darth Zeidah

"How [not]To Make Friends And To Influence People".

Dale Carnegie must be simultaneously rolling in his grave and laughing.

Levi Keller

that's what they taught me in Yeshiva...

MissingInfo

Is this guy a major haredi leader with a large following? Why was his name not reported?

Yochanan Lavie

Michael: I think Seymour was saying that many frum Yidden secretly or openly believe that in Messianic times (however defined) non-Jews will serve us as slaves or virtual slaves. That is probably true, although not universally true. There are midrashim to that effect, though many Modern Orthodox Jews do not take all midrashim literally.

Michael

Russian phd- all of what you say may be true, but it doesn't back Seymour's claim that many 'frum yidden' oppose Israel. Even if chabad sets up despicable schools that do not give their students the opportunities they deserve, they accept state funding. They are not Satmar, and they are not neturei Karta.

Most frum people (like myself) absolutely despise the fringe anti-Zionist chassidim.

Yosef ben Matitya

February 28, 2013 at 08:37 AM
Very well put Russian Phd. You see very well thru them.

The problem of segregation in Israel, commences with the very state itself. Jews and Arabs, secular and religious, dati leumi and chareidi, the various types thereof, even Atzmai are state funded.

larry

he is wearing one of those silly kippahs, however, that doesnt make him a chabbad messiansint.
like i said, if he was a messianist, then he would have referred to the rebbe when discussing the coming of moshaich.
havent you all caught onto scott rosenbergs trend--- he will take the slightest link to chabbad and twist and turn it to fit into his agenda.

Russian PhD

Michael,
To you knowledge, Chabad-Lubavitch schools in Israel are not belong to Hinuch Atzmai (Independent Education system). They are integral part of GOVERMENTAL education system (Memlachti). The Hutzpa of Chabad has no limits. They created the most primitive schools, with zero secular studies, with strict racial segregation (no single Ethiopian girl or boy is allowed in Chabad schools, even those that totally recognized as Jews by Israeli Rabbanut and coming from religious families), educating to zero alliance to the State of Israel, its Law and symbols-and all these schools are officially belong to Israeli Government and receive all funds and privileges!

Yochanan Lavie

Seymour: I know you're right, but my point is that leftish anti-Zionists shouldn't think that Satmar are so wonderful, or are the "true Jews" as opposed to the evil "Zionists." Extremists are basically alike.

(Disclosure: I am a moderate, but passionate, Zionist).

Michael

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/General+News/158777/Arabs-Staged-Price-Tag-Arson-to-Frame-Jews.html

I hate ywn, but its only fair to see that there are two sides in this issue and many are guilty on both sides.

Yosef ben Matitya

larry | February 28, 2013 at 08:20 AM
So why this scum wears “Yehi” kippah?

Maybe Larry is blind, no?
He is the advocate of lost causes.


Yosef ben Matitya

Maven
Not only tapuach.
count your 'blessings' today of israeli degenerates in the knesset.
Those of the likud without Meridor, those of Lieberman, those of that with the micro yarmulke, Bennis, his chums with Lapid, the hareidis, black and white. What is left as normal? We can equally move to Iran.

Russian PhD

Larry,

So why this scum wears “Yehi” kippah?

Michael

Definitely not many. those that are MO, religious zionist, radical settlers in the West Bank, and even most yeshivish people feel grateful for Israel. Yes, thry dont serve in the army, but they atent findamentally opposed to israel- but tbats a separate issue.They accept money from israel for chinuch atzmai schools, etc. The only ones that are legitimately opposed to Israel are chassidim.

Yosef ben Matitya

question about it,they should not be allowed to walk on the streets let alone have settlements.

problem, jancsi, is that the government tolerating them, is hardly any better than them!

larry

this guy is not a messiansit. scott rosenberg is trying to push his anti chabbad propoganda.
he does use the word mashiach, but he doesnt refer to the rebbe. in fact he says that moshaich has not come yet.

seymour

Posted by: Yochanan Lavie | February 28, 2013 at 07:25 AM

this is not only satmar but many frum yidden

Avi

That's what I call peaceful dialogue! A ten minute conversation between a Jew and Arabs, just talking no fighting.

maven

I've been to Tapuah, it should be relabeled as a mental hospital.

Russian PhD

Rocky,

May be secular Israelis, people that created this wonderful state, should better purify their homeland from messianic Haredi scum instead of leaving the country?

jancsibacsi

Theese chabad messianists broke out of a lunatic asylem they are mentally sick no question about it,they should not be allowed to walk on the streets let alone have settlements.

Russian PhD

I don’t think this guy is a leader or something like this. Probably he is an average piece of garbage that knows only to make degenerative kids and fill in applications for public assistance. But he says exactly what his “Messiah” Menachem M Shneerson taught his followers. And for these “values” (enslave or kill “improper” gentiles) Shneerson received congress medal from Reagan.

Russian PhD

After all Palestinians are too kind. In their place, I would beat to this scum his teethes into the throat and his balls to the abdomen.

Rocky

Reason #562 for secular Jews to leave Israel sooner than later and avoid the next big war. Leave the country to the Holy Rollers and their Messiah.

Yochanan Lavie

The anti-Zionist Satmar and their like also think the same thing. The only difference is that the Satmar don't want a Jewish state right now. So they pander to the Palestinians and commiserate with them about "oppression" by the "Zionists," wear kaffiyehs around their black-clad necks, wave signs at demonstrations with leftish buzzwords, and grovel before Afterdinnerjob in Iran. Meanwhile, as they are groveling, they are secretly harboring a sense of superiority and biding their time for the day when God will no longer punish Jews for their "sins" (including Zionism). On that day, they will rise up and slit the Palestinians' throats if the latter don't become Satmar slaves. At least with Kahanists, you know what you're getting.

seymour

Not bizarre, since he believes that when the messiah comes everything will revert back to the good old days as described in the Torah, and the Torah there where slaves and holy killing.

Yosef ben Matitya

why am i pretty sure that the jerk, his 'rabbis', (can you call them that?) his and their children, their grand children and their great great grand children will not see that day?
OTOH, they will live to see the wicked -them included- being punished.

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