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February 27, 2013

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to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

dd

you write "the rebbe is dead" = now chabad is no longer what its rebbe's seforim teach, now it can be changed to whatever self-proclaimed chasidim feel it should be.

if you understood what chabad-chasidism is, youd know that by definition, IT (its tenants & ideology) are ONLY codified by its spiritual leaders = aka is Rebbeim & not by ppl who claim to be followers

if a follower doesnt follow, (and acts in conflict with) its teachings, if one acts against the explicit teachings of his rebbe, he is by definition NOT a folower-chasid. nor does he have license or athorty to change re-write doctrine from the rebbeim

dd

the ' rebbe ' is dead . he is no longer present to tell them what to do , or to send someone to report what the 'rebbe' orders. therefore some chabad ppl are free to do whatever they want , including their chabad 'rabbis' . since the death of their 'rebbe' MMS , chabad is now free .

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

re "DORESH ET HAMEISIM"

YOU CLEARLY DO NOT KNOW THE DIFF BETWEEN "A TZADIK WITH RUACH HAKODESH" VS "UIIGI BOARD"

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

re a Rebbe as an "intermediary"
aka a "moses" of the generation
aka the "leader" ...the "head", the "Goel-hador" ...the "Nosi-Hador"

this is a long wel established juwish tradition of "roshei alfei yisroel" in each generation, to suggest that the "moses" concept is innovated by chasidus chabad is patently ignorant

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

shmarya

I never met a single opponent who rejects a legitimate chabad value
It's always something someone calling themselves chabad did or said
Which they have a problem with
Never something the Rebbe himself Teaches in his sichos & maamorim etc

dh

Theop @ 11:34

I guess you'll have to try a different way.

hechtele

If Aviva Bogart is not frum and has a partially shaved head, why does the official chabad.org publish her articles?

and why do they publicize "rabbi" Shmuel Braun's Classes?

HP Theoplogy

yes
shmarya banned me for a while
(that's what he does when he is cornered)

dh

Theop, you're back! How's tricks?

HP Theoplogy

nice cop-out by shmarya inc!

nice try Shmarya! to (so transparently) avoid answering tough questions!

when he has no rebuttal & is cornered

he Shmarya, resorts to name calling & belligerence as a tactic to skirt the "direct" reasonable challenge!

HP Theoplogy

nice cop out for shmarya!

nice try Shmarya, to (so transparently) avoid answering tough questions!

when he has no rebuttal & is cornered

he resorts to name calling & belligerence as a tactic to skirt the "direct" reasonable challenge!

Yochanan Lavie

Good one, Sarek.

Shmarya der Shteurmer

Please do NOT waste your time or the Rebbe's holy words in fighting these sad souls. They are no better than the anti-Semites who quote Gemara out of context to excuse their sick hatred.

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

shmarya

please cite a single source in chabad Rebbe's teachings which you reject or render wrong (wrong = as in not allowed by halacha/Torah)

thank you!

if you find a clever way to duck this question b generalizing or name calling, you confirm to all the obvious that you didn't rebut bec you have nothing (since if yo did yo would eagerly lay it out chapter & verse)

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

you have yet to provide a single source (chapter & verse quote) of a uniquely chabad Rebbe's chidush (teaching) which is in conflict with (not allowed by) Mainstream Halacha!

nor have you provided a single teaching of any of the Rebeim which is cause for many to become "turned off" by chabad bec of it!

all those who camed to be turned off by chasidus-chabad, when examined closely it allways turns out that they cannot point to a single Rebbe teaching, rather they instead find some person who acted in clear contradiction to its teachings! & then say, this man smokes, this man drinks, cheats, 7 he is jewish or he is (considered officially) chabad!v therefore it must be that I AM AGAINST CHABAD!!

(btw drinking more than 4 shots or smoking is explicitly against the Rebbe's teachings, yet you/shmarya continues to deliberately cat these practices as part of authentic chabad rather than what it really is, a gross departure of its chabad by ppl who dont act chabad but still call themselves chabad)

to "Abracadabra" NICE TRY!! (chaper & verse pls)

IN RESPONSE TO:
Abracadabra
YOU CLAIMED THAT:
Because the Alter Rebbe (in Tanya,says that the souls of gentiles "are like those of animals"
Actualy it describes the animals as in perfect alignment with gods will, & that when a jew sins he renders himself "lower" than a worm (creature) since the animal or insect are fulfilling their divine role!


---
THEN YOU (abracadabra) ALSO CLAIMED THAT:
Rabbi Shneur Zalman of Liadi, said that non-Jews don't get Olam Habbah

actually in the very first perek of Tanya it specifically & explicitly refers to Idol worshipers in the nations!!

it is a well established principle in Torah & chasidus that a gentile can get olam habba if he lives a righteous life via following the 7 laws of bnei noah!!

FINALLY YOU deceptively portrey the categories of creation...
Rocks
Plants
Animals
Non-Jews
Jews
as proof hat jews are superior to a gentile regardless of his/her actions
Chasids teaches that what maters is ones deeds!!! & if a jew's deeds are in conlict with his creator the he is inferior to ALL other beings!!!
and that jews (in Tanach not tanya) were chosen (singled out as the apple of god's eye!! to fulfill a unique exclusive role & mission "to be a light onto the nations" as Avraham avinu the first jew, to teach the rest of the nations of one god etc etc & to be a kindom of priests (mamleches kohanim vegoy kadosh) & holly-separate nation from the rest!!

note:
you have (conveniently) NOT provided chapter & verse for your deliberate fallacious misrepresentations!!

Seraphya

Yes, I was about to point to the first page of Tanya, but I see that has been done.

There is also the concept of the rebbe as an intermediary to G-d, which is in many sichos and such.

There is doresh et ha'meitim which the Rebbe did.

There is plenty more, but there is a start for "authentic" chabad values that I and many others reject.

Abracadabra

I never met a single opponent who rejects a legitimate chabad value
It's always something someone calling themselves chabad did or said
Which they have a problem with
Never something the Rebbe himself Teaches in his sichos & maamorim etc

What about the Alter Rebbe? Is he "someone calling themselves chabad"? Are his words considered "legitimate Chabad values"?

Because the Alter Rebbe (in Tanya, the most revered book in Chabad philosophy, a portion of which is recited daily by Chabad adherants) talks about how the souls of gentiles are like those of animals. The Alter Rebbe (Rabbi Shneur Zalman of Liadi, the first Rebbe of Chabad), said that non-Jews don't get Olam Habbah. And he said that there's a hierarchy of value and worth going from lowest to highest like this:

Rocks
Plants
Animals
Non-Jews
Jews

FYI - some people reject that.

And do give a look into the "No True Scottsman" logical falicy.

And while you're on Wikipedia, look at the definition of a cult, and the criteria. Try to be honest with yourself about it and you'll see that you're in a cult.

Joe

If Aviva Bogart is not frum and has a partially shaved head, why does the official chabad.org publish her articles?

Gopjew

Live frei or die trying

A True Scotsman

HP: Please read

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

HP

Since chabad is so accepting of all kinds of people & encourages & embraces everyone!! Invariably many (half baked) newcomers will dress the dress & look the look
But that doesn't mean they or anyone (even multi generational families) have license or authority to speak for chabad to define or modify its Teachings!

Only only it's Rebbe's have such authority!

HP

Authentic chabad is not what some youth are rejecting
Rather
It's the lack of REAL chabad teachings & values which causes some to think they don't like chabad

ca

Cool

Sarek

("Born Free")

I’m free, I’m free of the big cult
I’m free of their occult
I’m free to follow my heart

Live free, to worship as I please
No more 1390’s
No more first day to create a star

Stay free, no mechitza to divide us
We’re free of oppression
So there’s no more tension

Born free, Judaism’s worth keeping
Since we’re free of their kvetching
‘Cause we’re born free

Stay free, no mechitza to divide us
We’re free of oppression
So there’s no more tension

Born free, Judaism’s worth keeping
Since we’re free of their kvetching
‘Cause we’re born free

Victor

Chabad is at the forefront of the kiruv movement. They are the most accessible for troubled souls. May god bless them. What they need are more funding and more experienced therapists to intermingle with the troubled youth to help them navigate their internal conflicts. To find peace from within, find their soulmate and settle down and build a home filled with the love of god and torah.

WoolSilkCotton, I am a work of art as well as a sports and rock superstar

As long as Rubashkin = Chabad, you Chabadniks can all go token.

HP

I never met a single opponent who rejects a legitimate chabad value
It's always something someone calling themselves chabad did or said
Which they have a problem with
Never something the Rebbe himself Teaches in his sichos & maamorim etc

So if the only way you can knock chabad is by singling out those who (claim to follow its teachings buy who) in reality were do the opposite
Yet call themselves chabad

This is not proof that ppl reject authentic chabad

Only proof that ppl reject its perversion

HP

What many are turned off from is the distorted representation of Judaism
It's precisely when ppl who call themselves Rabbi's yet act in contrary to chabad's teachings!!

It's the "perversion" of the Authentic chabad theology that turns ppl off!

WoolSilkCotton, I am a work of art as well as a sports and rock superstar

And maybe they should also teach reading, writing, arithmetic, computer skills, US and world history.

HP

She's right & wrong

She says chabad needs change
Actually chabad-labled-schools need to change!! From their current practices & return to (& actually implement) the core spirituality & values of AUTHENTIC Chabad teachings!!
Namely,
1) the unconditional respect, Love & value of every human being (made in the image of the almighty)
2) the special greatness of a sincere pure unsophisticated worship of the Devine by even the most simple heart
3) To trully love God you must show love to his creations (ohev ma shehaOhuv Ohev)
4) in everything one can find a way to bring more light (love & godliness) to the world (aka Dira Batachtonim even in galus)
5) All your actions should be dedicated to Tikun Olam leading to the altimate universal Tikun in Geula!!

ruthie

this is very nice.
i wish more young people had access to something like this.
a jew is a jew is a jew

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