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February 07, 2012

Ex-Hasid Talks About Sex, Pedophilia And Dating Non-Jews

Deborah Feldman closeupNo one ever said the word “sex,” or even “vagina,” to me. We had no clue. We were like, “It’ll work out.” It never worked out. There is an actual rule that you learn before you get married that you are never supposed to look at genitalia. You can’t look at yours, and you can’t look at his. It’s always dark. There’s no hole in the sheet, but it’s pitch dark and there’s no looking and there’s a lot of fumbling around, and you’re wearing your nightgown rolled up to your waist. There’s no boob touching. Mine were totally wasted! There is no oral sex. After the first time, you have to call a rabbi and he asks the man questions — did this happen? And he declares you either unclean, or not yet consummated.

Deborah Feldman closeup
Deborah Feldman

Deborah Feldman, whose memoir on leaving the hasidic community of Williamsburg, Brooklyn, “Unorthodox: The Scandalous Rejection of My Hasidic Roots,” is slated to be published next week, was interviewed by the New York Post. Here's a brief excerpt from that much longer interview:

…The subject of sex was a total mystery to both you and your husband. What’s it like to embark on a sexual relationship when you have no idea how it works?

No one ever said the word “sex,” or even “vagina,” to me. We had no clue. We were like, “It’ll work out.” It never worked out. There is an actual rule that you learn before you get married that you are never supposed to look at genitalia. You can’t look at yours, and you can’t look at his. It’s always dark. There’s no hole in the sheet, but it’s pitch dark and there’s no looking and there’s a lot of fumbling around, and you’re wearing your nightgown rolled up to your waist. There’s no boob touching. Mine were totally wasted! There is no oral sex. After the first time, you have to call a rabbi and he asks the man questions — did this happen? And he declares you either unclean, or not yet consummated. Once you’re consummated, you’re unclean, because you bled. So after the first time, your honeymoon is a no-sex period.

For two weeks every month, he can’t touch you. He can’t hand you a glass, even if your fingers don’t touch. He has to put it down on the table and then you pick it up. Secondary contact can’t happen. If you’re sitting on a sofa, you have a divider between you. It makes you feel so gross. You feel like this animal in the room. If there’s a question about your period, you take the underwear and put it in a zip-lock bag, and give it to your husband. He takes it to the synagogue and pushes it into this special window and the rabbi looks at it and pronounces it kosher or nonkosher. It’s so disgusting.…

I was taught to believe that outsiders hated me. That if I talked to someone [non-Hasidic], I risked getting kidnapped and chopped into pieces. Never, ever talk to an outsider. Not even a policeman. Which is why what happened to Leiby Kletzky [the 8 year-old Borough Park boy who was brutally murdered in July; a fellow Hasid is currently facing charges for his murder] could have happened to me. I was taught to trust a Jewish person over someone wearing a cop uniform. If I got lost, to find a Hasid. There was this old man on my street who, every day on my way to school, would be sitting on this bench, and would call out to me and offer me candy. I told my grandfather, and he said, “Well, he’s older than you, so you have to talk to him out of respect.” The guy was, like, a pedophile. And we were taught to respect him.…

Over the past 10 or 20 years [the Hasidic community] has gone from being extreme to being ultra-extreme. They’ve passed more laws from out of nowhere, limiting women — there’s a rule that women can’t be on the street after a certain hour. That was new when I was growing up. We hear all these stories about Muslim extremists; how is this any better? This is just another example of extreme fundamentalism.

Do you see some signs of hope now, because outside influences are trickling into the cloistered community?

The neighborhood has changed drastically since I left. The hipsters came in the ’90s. And computers hit in a big way. Smartphones. Internet access. Now you can’t keep people from accessing information. It’s weakening the community’s hold over their own. It used to be that one person would leave, and then another 10 years later. It was always a big-deal scandal. This year, I went to a Thanksgiving dinner for people who are trying to get out, hosted by an organization called Footsteps, which helps people adjust to mainstream society. There were 350 people at this dinner. They had to rent out a loft in SoHo.

What’s your dating life like now?

Part of me is like, “I can’t date anybody. No one will [understand] me. I have a kid and I’m 25.” But there’s a man I met in New Orleans. He has his life there, and I have mine here. On paper, we don’t make sense at all — he’s Irish Catholic, he grew up in the backwoods. But he’s the only person I ever met that never made me feel weird about my life. He saw me for me. I thought that was impossible.…

Comments

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is slated to be published next week, was interviewed by the New York Post

The New York Post, I should have guessed. This rag is slowly becoming the preeminent anti-semetic paper right in the midst of one of the largest concentrated city of jews in the world.

But there’s a man I met in New Orleans ... he’s Irish Catholic, he grew up in the backwoods.

Enjoy your new life with Mr Bojangles, he sounds like a winner.

Please, the Book Publishing companies, haven't written a book about @Shmarya and he's way more interesting, knowledgeable and experiences then this girl. I mean what has she done in her life to have this whole news parade around her?.

Posted by: Confused | February 07, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Right, because anyone who disavows your way of life is wrong by definition and has to be invalidated so as not to force you to question your own life decisions.

No boob touching?! Why not just forget the sex altogether. No wonder this guys are bouncing off the walls. Even when they have sex they don't have sex.

you take the underwear and put it in a zip-lock bag, and give it to your husband. He takes it to the synagogue and pushes it into this special window and the rabbi looks at it and pronounces it kosher or nonkosher.

Any trouble getting applicants for this job?

As i said before each hassidishe generation is going deeper and deeper in tottal insanity into the abyss,the reason for this is they have it soo good all the sec.8 welfare food stamps affords them the time to dabble in mindless chumres they are removing themselfs from the real world into a world of tottal madness and mindlesness,a mind is a terrible thing to waste.

It would seem - based solely upon the published interview - that she paints the entire Chasidic world with a broad brush (duh, what else is new). However, whilst this may have been her experience, and i really do empathize with her, this is not necessarily the case with all.

The fact that her husband did not "play with her boobs", is a problem with her husband and her own lack of relationship and courtship. It may very well be due to te the particular community she grew up in, however, i can assure you, and i like to think of myself as a chusid, that my wife and i enjoy a really productive relationship.

the might be such people around, the majority of Hasidim enjoy sex the same way as non orthodox people do. She either lived in new square or needed a doctor.

please keep in mind that Satmar has nothing to do with judaism,it is a criminally insane Israel hating mindless cult,
classical judaism has always insisted that sex between husband and wife is beautifull and holy,and the husband is obligated to provide his wife with sexuall gratification,as a matter of fact it is one of the 613 MITZVAH'S in the torah,according to halacha,inside the marriage bed, nothing is prohibited as long as it's consensual.
this idiotic rule of shaving your head after marriage,is absolutely not halacha,but it was istituted 200 yrs ago in Hungary by some ignorant savage women hating rabbi's

"No wonder these guys are bouncing off the walls. Even when they have sex they don't have sex."
Hal, I'll be laughing the rest of the day at that...

"and you’re wearing your nightgown rolled up to your waist. There’s no boob touching. "

I was from a Boro Park, and not a Williamsburg sect, and both of these statements are simply not true - and I was given my "choson" formation by an ultra-frummie.

Much of the rest is true, in consonance with halacha.

Eli, let me ask a different question. What kind of man is able to be in bed with his wife during permitted times and NOT touch her boobs. Can't get my mind around that.

my own kid told me that if they ever get divorced their next spouse will not be Jewish, and I ought to get used to it.

I told them that if they are in love and happy, I really and truly don't care - and I really and truly don't.

@ Eli -- a gay one, maybe?

There is a similar article in the Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2097763/Sexual-assault-12-married-17-divorced-23-One-womans-explosive-revelations-life-ultra-conservative-Hasidic-household.html?ito=feeds-newsxml).

It's funny that a lot of things they make a big deal about are not specific to Satmar or to Charedi groups in general, but are just normal Orthodox practice.

And at least her husband took her underwear in a ziploc and passed it through a slot, very modestly/privately. In my community, we handed the underwear directly to the rabbi and stood there while he held it up to the window for better light!

There are clearly a lot of things missing from her story. I am confused about how a person raised entirely within the Satmar community suddenly decides to enroll at Sarah Lawrence and has no trouble getting in.

Also, is it true that women are not allowed to eat out? That's a new one on me. . .

I'm also confused about the "nightgown rolled up to the waist" thing, since there are sources that say both parties must be completely undressed. (I had understood that part of the reason was to distinguish from the animalistic practice of non-holy societies, who just lift the skirt or whatever.) This seems to go very contrary to that.

it is really sad that this is her take on judaism. judaism can be wonderful and she let a few bad influences get her down...

Maybe she got that idea (of rolling up the nightgown) from that abomination of a movie, "Kadosh", which has a lot of odd practices in it, including having the mikvah lady push the woman under the water by the head, leaving her hand on the woman's head the whole time, while the woman holds her nose with one hand and grasps the edge of the mikvah tub with the other. . .

Any trouble getting applicants for this job?

Posted by: Rebitzman | February 07, 2012 at 10:30 AM

Are you saying that they would or would not like examining underwear? I think the rabbis that I have consulted treated it like any other mitzvah-related work, and were neither repulsed nor aroused by it. I, on the other hand, found it quite a strain on my sense of modesty.

I'm so glad we Conservatives don't have any rules.

Dr. Phil or Oprah should do a show on how the Rabbi inspects panties through a special window in a zip-lock bag. The "PANTIE POLICE" would be very interesting to view.

I'm so glad we Conservatives don't have any rules. . .

Posted by: Devorah | February 07, 2012 at 11:25 AM

?! Conservative have rules. You must be thinking of Reform.

Shmaryahu should change -
this idiotic rule of shaving your head after marriage,is absolutely not halacha,but it was istituted 200 yrs ago in Hungary by some ignorant savage women hating rabbi's.Do you have any prove that it was instituted in hungary looks like you have a grudge against hungarian jews

By the way forgot i am also a hungarian jew and i hate them as much if not more then you do, the fanatics that is


אשה זונה וחללה, אין צוגאב א שקרנ'טע אויך

Couple of points:

A:I happened to know her family and while there are some nice people in her family, in general its a very dysfunctional family.She aint playing with a full deck.
And that's the case most of the time when people leave the fold.

B:Things that you are or aren't allowed to do while being a niddah has nothing to do with Jews from Brooklyn or satmar.Thats just the laws of niddah.

C:I have no clue where shes getting off how things are being done in the bedroom.
Seems like she had a frustrated marriage.
In other words shes lying not only about the boob part.


There are about 6 million jews in the U.S. 95% are complete frie so welcome to the frie jungle ms feldman you're free to join your frie mom and your irish redneck, just make sure you pay his tab! and all will be fine.

Shmarya, publish an affiliate link.

I'm gonna buy it, you might as well get the credit.

Apologies to the Allman Bros. (Ramblin Man):

Chorus:
L-rd, I was born an Irishman
Tryin' to meet a Jewess and doin' the best I can
And when she's ripe for leavin' I hope you'll understand
That I was born an Irishman

Well her father was a Hasid down in Brooklyn
And she wound up on the wrong side of a choson
And she was born in the back seat of a ... Mehadrin bus
Rollin' down Yerushalayim

chorus

Aw-right!

I'm on my way to New Orleans this mornin'
Leavin' out of Dublin, can't you see,
They're always havin' a shidduch down on the bayou
L-rd, them Jewish women think the world of me

Chorus

L-rd, I was born an Irishman 4x

Yochanan Lavie Apologies to the Allman Bros. (Ramblin Man):

I'm surprised you didn't choose to parody "Tied to the Whipping Post."

Guvezner Chusid - Plenty of gay men who would never touch "fish" still love them the ta-tas.

Hal: That would have been a good one. I should have wrote for the chorus: "Tryin' to meet a Jewess and feeling her breasts, oh man!"

YL, very nice (as usual) but when I read "confused"'s reference to Mr Bojangles, I couldn't help myself but think of our lansman, the late and great Sammy Davis Jr., belting out his rendition of Jerry Jeff Walker's "Mr Bojangles". Ah the memories!

OFF TOPIC - my apologies but i dont see any posting yet from shmarya...

news reports on line say that Shaul Spitzer the Skver arsonist plead guity this morning to 1st degree assault...

http://www.lohud.com/article/20120207/NEWS03/302070080/1019


FYI...

KJ: Yes, I am a Sammy fan and I loved his cover of that song. I was thinking of doing a parody of "Bojangles," but i decided that "Ramblin' Man," with its more upbeat tempo, would be a better New Orleans song to describe the situation.

YL - I had a feeling you'd be inspired by this one.

she should have stayed a chassid, she looks like a dog.

A:I happened to know her family and while there are some nice people in her family, in general its a very dysfunctional family.She aint playing with a full deck.
And that's the case most of the time when people leave the fold.


Posted by: Deremes | February 07, 2012 at 11:35 AM

This is cult mentality 101. Textbook cult mindset. Religions don't enslave people, okay?

different dave That wasn't nice. And I don't agree. I think she's cute.

Rebbitzman: Thanks, I think...

Shoshi-
My experiences were like yours, but I was never a chasid.

Deremes:

I'm not saying that she didn't come from a horrible family (God knows we have our share of them) but, of course, anyone who is happy where they are stays there.

"Dysfunctional" types who are unhappy with their communities may develop enough courage to actually break the ties that bind them and leave, such as those who become ba'alei tshuva or gerei tsedek or gevezene chasidim.

B:Things that you are or aren't allowed to do while being a niddah has nothing to do with Jews from Brooklyn or satmar.Thats just the laws of niddah.

Deremes

With all due respect, as with almost everything in halacha, there is no one set of rules. I know hareidim like to think that their dereh is emet, but most of the time its just baloney

I wonder if the Satmar Rebbe takes a whiff of the panties, just to be extra sure.

This lady is real hot, if only more the cute frum girls would come to the dark side...

Gevezener Chusid,

Agreed.
You also pointed out that she is not telling the truth which means she lies.
Read it in the NY Post and you will see how much she lies.
Halacha has nothing to do with satmar or any other group. But she is trying to make it sound that this is how it is in Wiiliamsburg ONLY.

To point out another lie when she says:
"My ex-husband is so much less religious now. He cut his beard short, he wears jeans. It’s because there’s no room for divorced people in the community"
the lie and the BS cant be any bigger.As you know there are loads of divorced people in the frum community.

Gevezener Chusid,

Agreed.
You also pointed out that she is not telling the truth which means she lies.
Read it in the NY Post and you will see how much she lies.
Halacha has nothing to do with satmar or any other group. But she is trying to make it sound that this is how it is in Wiiliamsburg ONLY.

To point out another lie when she says:
"My ex-husband is so much less religious now. He cut his beard short, he wears jeans. It’s because there’s no room for divorced people in the community"
the lie and the BS cant be any bigger.As you know there are loads of divorced people in the frum community.

Deremes-Maybee youre lying to youreself and blind to what really goes on how would you know, are you god to see into peoples minds what she says has alot of truth to it and that is what counts.

"I'm also confused about the "nightgown rolled up to the waist" thing, since there are sources that say both parties must be completely undressed. (I had understood that part of the reason was to distinguish from the animalistic practice of non-holy societies, who just lift the skirt or whatever.) This seems to go very contrary to that.

Posted by: Shoshi | February 07, 2012 at 11:17 AM "

There are sources that say no oral sex but loads of people do that too.

"Sources" don't mean anything. There are no sources which say to keep harchakos all month, but Gerrer Chassidim [are supposed to] do that.

Different Dave, her looks are irrelevant. It could have been I, had I been a chusid and I'm a looker! :)

Hey shes entitled to make it up as she goes along - just like Boteach.

I can understand partly why she left ( not really ) but to drop so low...... You can go modern ortho but to the bottom... she must have been some kid....

A disfunctional unit within a set can be decribed as f(-x) or -f(x)

so
f(C), where C = cult, = -C
and
f(F), where F = family, = -F

therefore f(C)*f(F)>0

So mathematically it's proven that being a disfunctional family member within a disfunctional cult can only result in a positive result.

I gotta believe there are people who have a frummie sex fetish. To them, niddah; painties in a ziploc; total darkness; etc. is a total turn-on. It's yiddish s & m with a bissel b & d. Rabbi as master; rebbetzin as mistress. Shmarya, we need an expose'.

By the way for those the read the article in the actual NY Post, you would see that they paid for her designer clothing she wear;s for the photo shoot on Marcy Ave. So much for her great new life,I guess she isn't exactly in the 1%.

Deborha is a hero by identifying the extremist views on sex in contemporary judisem. oral sex is viewed as dirty and prohibited even though mimonides states a man may do with his wife what ever he pleases.. The well known halacha that sex should be done as being forced by a ghost, explains the mentality of rabbinic authorities.

The rabbinical panty inspection is one of the most creepy, fucked up things I have ever heard. It's just plain sick.

Someone did not close their tags.

Abandoned by a mother who left the faith and a father who was mentally disabled, she was taken in by her grandparents

I knew there had to be something here. Sounded like there were psychological issues at play.

Deremes -- She may not be accurate about all frumma sex. but who's to say that she's not accurate about sex with her husband?

There's a LOT of bad sex out there. Frum men can (and sometimes are) certainly part of it. She's not the first ex-frum woman I've heard from/of with similar complaints.

I'm tired of the bold. Is this better?

Posted by: Malka Gittel | February 07, 2012 at 02:53 PM.

EXACTLY the point i made when i said "I have no clue where shes getting off how things are being done in the bedroom.
Seems like she had a frustrated marriage.
In other words shes lying not only about the boob part."
I suppose i didn't say it clear enough that this was the case in her bedroom.
In any-case like everything else she says some truth and many many lies and i pointed out some of it.
But all of you go ahead and comment on stuff that isn't so and the stuff that IS as she said is not ONLY by frum Jews who live in Brooklyn.But being the liar that she is she makes a point that that is the case only in Satmar but in reality hilchas niddah is observed not only in Satmar.

despite her white-washing, Mikva ≠ Spa!

Google this, different view

Deremes, all your talk of sex is getting' me kinda hot and horny... You're SUCH a teaser, you are!

I agree with danny, the rabbinical panty inspection is very fucked up along the same lines as metzitzah bepeh

Thinking this over it looks like she had or still has deep mental problems the reason i think so is that she went out of her way with a vengeance to hit back tottly against everything she stood for, maybee its a family problem her mother left frumkeit its all in the family seems to me.

I can't help thinking that if I were a rabbi the whole panty business is a job I just wouldn't want. You'd think they'd find an excuse to make this a rebbitzin's thing. There's nothing sexy about the average woman's used underwear. This is not the community keeping Victoria's Secret in business.

I don't know her family and obviously -as someone pointed out- people who are so called losers in any community, are more willing to - and feel they must - leave where they are, and start a new life.


But, what I can't comprehend, why does she feel that she "must" resort to verifiable outright lies in order to make her case?!

The chasidic life style is hard enough- at least for outsiders to understand- to live by, and people would of "understood" that not each and everyone who is born into this community (there's lots of misfits in williamsburg) is willing and able to continue this way of life,

To prove my point that she's a rebel just for the sake of being a rebel,
That she had to go "all in"!
Wouldn't it serve her better and for her family she - she said-still cares for, to enroll in a different form of jewish life?


Like my ziadeh used to say,
פארדארבען קען א קאץ אויך...To spoil something, a cat can also be reliable...


Yeh: the chasidim are instilling tremendous fear of "strangers" non chasidics, and that why a chasidic child leiby kletzky was "cut into pieces" by a "fellow chasid"! Outrageous!

Sex sells! She is not the first and certainly will not be the last to get on the gravy train.

Malka Gitte-Since theese rebbis have no self respect when it comes to making money its all money, they would eat shit if it takes that to make money.

they would eat shit if it takes that to make money. Posted by: jancsipista | February 07, 2012 at 03:49 PM
-----
You and all know, that no monies is changing hands in this process!

Dan, vus haksti a chienik?!

She does admit that her father was below averagw intelligence and that her mom left the community whilst leaving her with the grandparents. Perhaps the story is more complex then she (or her publisher) is leting on.

why does she feel that she "must" resort to verifiable outright lies in order to make her case

Be specific - where has she lied?

Thinking this over it looks like she had or still has deep mental problems the reason i think so is that she went out of her way with a vengeance to hit back tottly against everything she stood for,"

Posted by: jancsipista | February 07, 2012 at 03:18 PM

I agree.
Why is she writing this book? To prove to the world she is not frum, so she dresses immodestly, eats treif, and has sex with a goy?

Her life style seems more trashy than frei.

A misconception by the frumma is that the frei and goyim have indiscriminate sex and lead a racy life.

If she went to a store and saw an immodest dress she liked and bought it --ok. However, it seems that she goes out of her way to buy immodest clothing and say, "look what I'm wearing now!" The same goes with her eating treif.

Feldman will learn that to the goyim she will still be "the little Jewish girl," even if she is not frum.

Does she envision herself as the next Naomi Ragen?

Does she envision herself as the next Naomi Ragen?

Posted by: Bas Melech | February 07, 2012 at 05:28 PM

Based on the article, it seems she thinks she is the next Kardashian.

@Rebitzman | February 07, 2012 at 10:30 AM

Truse story : I was once in need of a psak on a certain stain, the rav I normally went to was on vacation so I went to another rav nearby and handed him the envelope, asked him to give it a looksee - he was red-faced as he refused the envelope; I asked why and he told me he was color blind. I asked around and I was like 2 of 1000 people that didn't know. Well don't I feel like the friggin icehole. That was one of the last times I played smell the square cloth ifyaknowhatimean.

I wonder if the Satmar Rebbe takes a whiff of the panties, just to be extra sure

Yes he does, but only if they belong to a young woman. Otherwise, he treats it as yoshon.

My take is this broad has daddy and/or authority issues and doesn't feel comfortable without her ankles pinned somewhere south of her ears as she gets plowed by the next loser with a broken front teeth and two first names like Joe Bob or Billy Ray. Like you want to 'leave the fold' that's cool and so you got divorced, no big deal, but when you come off sounding like a total fraud it doesn't help impress people that you've found yourself or a better life.

Be specific - where has she lied?


Posted by: Rebitzman | February 07, 2012 at 04:55 PM

You "know" that she's lying about the "sheet"....
Well, "everybody" knows that a "sheet" IS involved in all chasidic bedrooms.....
You won't "deny" it! Right? Will you dare?...


(Do you get my point?)

So what happened? The New York Post and Rupert Murdoch used to be our friends. But I hear his son is with the arabs. Every chance they get they are mocking us. not like in the old days.

Yidden, remember: we cannot count on any goy to be our friend.

no boob touching? no oral? hell, if she was my wife there would be no sex of any kind. period.

Mordechai this has to be the stupidest comment you ever posted (and that's saying a lot). Rebitzman asked a reasonable question.

You men are having a lot of fun with this post.
Question: Do some of the rabbis who inspect the cotton square have no reaction, because it comes from a woman?.....

Bas Melech, don't kid yourself, Deb can suck a golf ball through a garden hose and lay back with a bear, which to me, that's a lady! Oh! (Hat tip Andrew Silverstein)

@Mordechai

In spite of many many articles and movies that say otherwise, I do concede that not a single Orthodox couple I know uses a sheet.

That said, there are far more Orthodox couple I know that I would never ask - I do not like bloody noses (especially when they are mine).

THAT said - my own study of Talmud (Nedarim 20a) would lead me to conclude that if the sheet is an actual custom at the fringe - it ain't the norm.

That in and of itself does not mean she's lying - but my own guess is that some goy saw a tallit katan hanging out to dry, mistook it for a sheet, saw the hole, and did the math.

Point conceded.

. . .I asked around and I was like 2 of 1000 people that didn't know. . .

Posted by: BiF | February 07, 2012 at 05:40 PM

I don't get it--you were 2 of 1000 that didn't know WHAT?

Why is she writing this book? To prove to the world she is not frum, so she dresses immodestly, eats treif, and has sex with a goy?

M O N E Y

I would gladly have sex with her and show her what she was missing out on for all those years

I for one would read the book.
Probably a lot of rules are decided withhin the family or small Shteibel.

I belive for a while they were asking their young people to not mill about pizza stores so when that didn't work mabe they tried to ban women from eating out.

this is a nice positive development for human freedom from tyrany.

@Mordechai

New thread at head of FM that demands review

Deborah Feldman, meet Luzer Twersky. I think we have a shidduch.

i feel bad for her. She obviously had a bad experience. And she has found something that works for her, which is great. She still does many many mitzvahs, and the ones that are hard for her to relate to because of either her past, or her lack of sophistication, she doesn't keep. She is like most people in the world. But as a therapist, I must say that her chances of being sexually abused as a child, treated like a sex object by men, and not having tools to cope emotionally with what she is going through are far higher as a secular person, than as a religious one. The abuse of kids, and objectification of women in secular society is a real problem, and its funny to me that people flee the chassidic life to embrace this, which is clearly worse!

Posted by: ah pee | February 07, 2012 at 09:30 PM

Please.

The CDC's info indicates that child sex abuse happens at the same frequency in the haredi community as it does out of it, and haredi attempts to cover up for pedophiles and the mesira law in reality probably make child sex abuse **more** common in haredi communities, not less common.

>We hear all these stories about Muslim extremists; how is this any better?

One comes to expect such shallow comparisons.

Isn't the whole issue these days with the
*political* ramifications of Islamicism?
Never mind that that Islamic clerics delayed the industrialization of Turkey and totally wrecked their empire; who ever liked the Ottoman's anyway? But when the rioting and threats of violence spill over
into real violence, car bombs, and
insurrection on a national scale we are
supposed to think this is equivalent to
the social radicalism of Williamsburg or
Mea Shearim? There's a reason the word
l'havidil is used.

His loss, she is very cute. What she mentioned does not surprise me at all, it is typical in cultist lifestyles. These people have a real hard time thinking and making decisions by themselves. I am glad she left.

@Posted by: ah pee

Are you a therapist who specializes in bringing people back into cults? Just wondering.


My take is this broad has daddy and/or authority issues and doesn't feel comfortable without her ankles pinned somewhere south of her ears as she gets plowed by the next loser with a broken front teeth and two first names like Joe Bob or Billy Ray. Like you want to 'leave the fold' that's cool and so you got divorced, no big deal, but when you come off sounding like a total fraud it doesn't help impress people that you've found yourself or a better life.

Posted by: BiF |
-------------------------------
2 first names?
Like Menachem Mendel?

Hello Miss Bitter Feldman. Look into the mirror and u might understand why doing it in the dark is sometimes the better way to go about it. I don't mean to be nasty and I hate doing this to you but you surely need lots of help. I'm soory that things didn't work out for you and you had a rough upbringing, but remember u not the only that had it hard (try to think clean for one second)I'll Daven for you to get the right help, you can surely use it!!

Barely Cares, well done! A diamond in the rough.

Sol, sexual relations are not taboo, besides, why do you think the Creator made them so exhilarating when you have the right companion? To be enjoyed dumb dumb. Sol, I don't mean to be nasty to you either, but you are definitely sexually repressed and you are in no position to tell this girl or anyone whatsoever what healthy sex is all about. I on the same token recommend you to get some REAL help, not the brainwash cultist mentality help you usually get. Sayonara!

Point conceded.

Posted by: Rebitzman | February 07, 2012 at 07:32 PM
------
You are busy to prove that "you" don't believe(Feldman also says its not true) "the sheet" usage..

I was trying to point out , that no matter how much a chasid will try to prove that "the sheet" is a fabricated lie,( I heard that it originates from a movie, there a cop asks from another cop in Brooklyn, if its true) it will stay a matter of fact, and the chasid is lying out of shame or inconvenience.

So when you asked me to point out where she was lying, I answered you that there's no point, because in the end "I" will be the liar....

But out of respect for skepticalyid I will show you just a few, some you can prove yourself when you go visit williamsburg,some she just twisted but it makes a whole lot of a difference in the meaning. Some I can't prove you like "the sheet" ( I like calling it "the sheet" because this is how outside people referred to the issue when they asked me about it...)


1) There's no rule or halacha that a "woman" is not allowed to look at her private parts,(at least what I know of)


2)Her description what's going on in a chasidic bedroom is an outright lie,(I'm trying to keep it clean)

3) A nidah does NOT feel gross or the animal in the room, and asking a dayin is NOT disgusting (I heard that in the alter hiem there were women answering those questions,)


4) You were NOT made to believe that outsiders hated you(FM wasn't yet launched back when you were a little girl...just kidding).and will chop you into pieces.


5) Scared of cops! Give me a break!


6)Her whole lieby Kletzky story is twisted and stupidly laid blame on the boy not asking a cop for directions.
"Fellow chasid" just to besmirch chasidim, when in fact he was never a chasid, and for many years not even religious.


7) Teaching to talk and respect pedophiles because they are older, nut case!


8)Go visit williamsburg and tell me if you don't see women on the street at any given time of the day.


9)Go into any restaurant and see if there's no women inside "eating out", as she claims its forbidden

And there's SO much more .


Her biggest lie is....
The only way to fool a guy to be with her, is thru-how you guys like to call it- forced marriage....I doubt anyone in New orleans is showing any interest....(Sorry, it slipped out,)

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