Women Soldiers Leave IDF Event After Being Forced To Segregate
About 100 female soldiers left the main non-holy-day celebration sponsored by the Israel Defense Forces marking the second non-holy-day night of the Shemini Atzeret/Simhat Torah holiday on Thursday after they were told to move to a separate women's section.
IDF soldiers (file photo)
Female soldiers leave IDF event after ordered to sit in separate section
The commanders of the women soldiers decided to have the women board buses and leave after some objected to their being directed to a separate area cut off from the main event.
By Anshel Pfeffer • Ha’aretz
About 100 female soldiers left the main celebration sponsored by the Israel Defense Forces marking the end of the Simhat Torah holiday on Thursday after they were asked to move to a separate women's section.
The traditional "Hakafot Shniyot" event, which comes after the holiday's formal conclusion and includes dancing [usually to live music] with the Torah, was held in the Eshkol regional council area in the south. The commanders of the women soldiers decided to have the women board buses and leave after some objected to their being directed to a separate area cut off from the main event.
The separate women's section was set off by cloth sheeting, but according to one of those present "it was very hard to feel connected to the event there." The event was attended by about 500 people, including a mix of civilians and soldiers, among them, about 100 women soldiers. Those in attendance said before the request was made for them to move, the women had been dancing at one side, separately from the men and also separated by a long table. The women soldiers were then ordered by an officer from the military rabbinate to go to a separate, closed area about 50 meters away, following complaints over the initial setup.
Orthodox Jewish religious authorities call for separation of men and women in certain circumstances. For many observant Jews in Israel, however, it is the custom for men and women at Hakafot Shniyot to dance separately but without the women being relegated to another designated area. The IDF's chief rabbi, Rafi Peretz, as well as the commander for the IDF's Gaza division, Yossi Bachar, were present but did not intervene in the matter. The rabbinate has been under pressure recently to adopt strict interpretations of halakha, Jewish religious law.
The IDF Spokesman's office said in response: "As is the custom at these events every year, there is an area designated for women," adding that "no IDF official was directed to verify that men and women were separated." The IDF rabbinate is unaware of some of the complaints made over the issue and the matter will be looked into, the spokesman said.
These events are like street parties with live bands, vendors selling food, and often with open bottles of alcohol passed around by partiers. I participated in several of these events in the Old City of Jerusalem and Tzefat in the late 1980s and mid-1990s – sponsored by yeshivas, hasidic groups and even the municipality – and there were no partitions separating men and women at any of them. Men danced in one area, women in another, without any screens or barriers to separate them. Particiapnts ranged in age from small children through the elderly, with many entire families attending.
[usually to live music]
What is "live music"? Is that in contrast to sheet music?
Noteworthy that their commanding officers jumped the moment one of them had an emotion but if they were guys they'd have to choose between sucking it up or being dishonorably discharged.
Posted by: Maskil | October 23, 2011 at 09:55 AM
Live music means as opposed to recorded music.
Posted by: dlz | October 23, 2011 at 10:03 AM
That soldier has a great tuchus!
Posted by: Zoobiemanyak | October 23, 2011 at 10:05 AM
Read JoeSettler's blog, the story is made up of twisted facts...The story is that there is no story...
Posted by: aaa | October 23, 2011 at 10:07 AM
@Maskil.. you're assuming it was a mandatory event and that they were there under orders. It's quite possible that it was voluntary. Noteworthy that you allow your emotional prejudices against women to interfere with your analysis.
Posted by: SkepticalYid | October 23, 2011 at 10:14 AM
this makes sense
ask them to rick their lives to defend the country and them tell them
to the back please
Posted by: seymour | October 23, 2011 at 10:31 AM
even in frumma shules, the women don't much enjoy Simchas Torah. I would say it's their least favorite part of the year the most humiliating. They do it for the children and taking one for the team.
Some MO allow them to dance with a Torah but not all, it is not mainstream practice at all. I had a lot of respect for the women when I served they provided alot of physicological help just being there and of course their work is helpful to the army on many levels. It was very gratifying to speak to people on such a higher madregga than the crap men i had to serve with.
Posted by: Adams | October 23, 2011 at 10:46 AM
I also dont enjoy Simchas torah except for the Kiddish at the end. If you are socially outcasted it's quite an ordeal to spend all this time with men with the dancing the holding hands etc.I skipped out on the night part and more or less on the day part loafed around. Found 2 stoned kids to joke with, yeshiva dropouts. Didn't let on that I had also imbibed a small cannabis brownie to enhance my simchas Yom Tov.
Posted by: Adams | October 23, 2011 at 10:49 AM
Where does it end? Are the Orthodox soldiers next going to say that they shouldn't have to serve in units with women, or take orders from female commanders? And will the usual suspects defend them then as "just needing to make accommodation?"
Posted by: Elisheva | October 23, 2011 at 03:16 PM
It's my understanding that many already serve in male only units, such as Nahal Haredi. Additonally, their faith system does forbid women to have authority over them. So your questions are already answered :-/
Posted by: SkepticalYid | October 23, 2011 at 04:52 PM
Forget about the event; they should leave the army. In fact, leave the country. Let the black-hatted bastards defend themselves.
When I think of the millions who died in the Holocaust, yet the gene pools that produced these shotehs survived... it makes me ill.
Posted by: Jeff | October 23, 2011 at 04:56 PM
That soldier has a great tuchus!
Posted by: Zoobiemanyak | October 23, 2011 at 10:05 AM
....If you like ghetto booty. Funny cuz that's the first thing I noticed about the story was that the chick got a big butt. But ...I like big butts and I can not lie, etc etc.
Posted by: Common Sense | October 23, 2011 at 08:38 PM
That soldier has a great tuchus!
Posted by: Zoobiemanyak | October 23, 2011 at 10:05 AM
Oh yeahhhh
Posted by: jvliv | October 23, 2011 at 10:18 PM
can you imagine what the front of her looks like considering she has such an amazing tuchas....maybe those who directed them behind the mechitzah, had they seen her....would have reconsidered?
Posted by: concerned individual | October 23, 2011 at 11:05 PM
you guys should go serve, looks like you will enjoy the time. Go for it!
Posted by: Adams | October 24, 2011 at 06:38 PM