Video: Arrests In Kiryas Joel

An update on the hikers arrested in Kiryas Joel Sunday because they "looked suspicious" and were taking pictures.

One of the claims made by Kiryas Joel's constable, Moses Witriol, is that the hikers were taking pictures of public buildings and schools. Here's one of those pictures from a hiker's Flikr feed:

 

Related Post: Arrests In Kiryas Joel, Part 1.

[Hat Tip: 613 Enforcer.]

Comments

[tooclose2detroit]

yes-now they're "hikers"--the other day, they were "kids"aghh-what can i say-the libb mind is incapable of fixing-i dont know why i bother.

[effie]

Sue the pants off them!

[David]

I think the guy accidentally mixed up his Saudi Arabian vacation snaps with his visit to the New York village...

[Dan]

I think the question we all have to ask ourselves is, how does someone read the word "Joel" and pronounce it "Joelle"?

[Morris the Katz]

I took a picture of that very "No gurlz allowed" sign several years ago, when I drove to Kiryas Joel to see it for myself.

That sign is the only thing in this instant slum which is worthy of a photograph.

Nobody bothered me.

[Dan]

The visitors here were totally right. The officers recognized that they can't just stop anybody and ask them for their ID, but they felt that if they're called in to investigate suspicious activity, then they can demand ID, because it’d be crazy for them to just walk away and not ask the most basic questions. But that just means that anytime an officer wants to stop someone and ask for their ID, on no grounds whatsoever, all he has to do is call another officer and tell him there’s something going on. The second officer will then have no choice but to demand ID, because he’s been called to a scene and he can’t judge if anything has happened or not. So as far as he’s concerned that’s “reasonable suspicion.”

But it can’t work that way. The first officer has to have some sort of grounds for suspicion. Which, in this case, means that Witriol has to explain why he has cause to demand ID. He can’t just stand there like a putz and not say a word, and the state officers can’t let him get away with that. They can’t direct their entire inquiry toward the kids, they have to ask Witriol what his cause for suspicion is.

And the fact that the kids were taking pictures is not nearly enough. If I can walk on 34th Street and take pictures of the Empire State Building, I can walk in Kiryas Joel and take pictures too. It’s the same country. Witriol’s Chassidus doesn’t change that.

[Guest]

Everyone just think for one second about the following scenario:

You're sitting on the grass in the front of your house with your children. Five Arabs stop in front of your house and begin filming you and your kids and your house. They also start laughing and pointing at you. They converse in Arabic, and you think you hear something about Allah Akbar.

Then they move on. They're still looking at you and laughing at you.

Remember, this is America, not Israel, and there is nothing you can do about it. They have every right to film you. Nobody can ask them for ID, since no crime was committed. And so you will not be abe to find out who they are.

You will be left hugging your kids every night for the rest of your life wondering.... and having nightmares.

America!!

[Morris the Katz]

Taking picture of a sign saying "No gurlz allowed" in English, Spanish, and Polish doesn't strike me as very suspicious behavior, unless you're a fat pig of a Hasid trying to cover something up which may not be technically illegal, but which sure is abhorrent.

But arresting these hikers, kids, college students, troublemakers, or whatever sure is illegal.

[Dan]

Guest,

You're dead wrong. THAT would be called suspicious activity. Could they be arrested on the spot for that, no questions asked? No. But you could expect the police to question them.

What these kids did was totally innocent and only a backwoods redneck Chassid would think he had a right to put a stop to it.

[Bfeirush in Fartscroll]

Did Vitriol grab them as a means of foreplay? We all know that man on man buttluvin in KJ is as common as a spic carrying a blade.

[seymour]

Posted by: Guest | August 04, 2011 at 04:43 PM

what is your point

that all Arabs are terrorists. that those guys look like terrorists

my guess is KJ wants to run their town as if it private

[Skepticalyid]

Did they get lunch while they were being detained in Yossi's restaurant. :-)

[seymour]

going to kj is like going to a different world with those signs about dress and other stuff

it is picture heaven

[Yankel]

This is common abuse, the NYS Police officer should be fired!

[Skepticalyid]

Personally I think if the deputy had simply approached them, asked if he could help them and then escorted them to a restaurant where they could have lunch, all this would have been avoided. Were they being rude; ogling and photographing the natives? probably. Were they suspicious characters? Highly unlikely.

[Guest]

My point is that the same America that doesn't allow the police officer in KJ to arrest someone for failing to give ID (even when doing suspicious activities), is the same America that won't allow Arabs to be arrested for failing to give ID (even when doing suspicious activities).

Of course you will say that Arabs are suspicious, and strangers taking pictures in KJ are not suspicious.

Others will disagree with you. Many in KJ would feel that that is very suspicious.

Don't forget, the liberals will say that Arabs are NEVER suspicious.

So before you jump on KJ for this story, think about what you would do if you felt that someone was being very suspicious in front of your house.

[Morris the Katz]

They were taking a picture of a sign on a fence, behind which was a weed-infested vacant lot, saying "No Gurlz Allowed."

Come to think of it, maybe the picture should be blown up 10X. Then I can see exactly what kind of "weed" grew beyond the chain-link fence.

[Skepticalyid]

@Guest: I'm quite liberal on a number of issues. I would never say that "Arabs are NEVER suspicious." I would say that it depends on the circumstances. I would say the same about Blacks, Hispanics, Native Americans and White people too! Unlike YOU ,I don't make stupid baseless assumptions about entire groups.

[Shmertzl]

My heart goes out for these poor innocent youngsters, who juuust wanted to tour this little village and by no means meant any trouble. And then, those mean residence filled with hatred called on their barbaric Public Safety officers, who grabbed on to those nothing meaning by walkers, and just ruined their planned day of leisure out in KJ.

Oh, how mean!

All this group wanted is a trip out in the Shpitzle filled Village, and have a taste of the famously delicious Chasidic Pizza, and just have a grand old good time.

This is a shame!

Just like any fur hat'ed, long bearded, sidelock'ed Cahsidishe Yid can walk into any Village in NY and snap pictures and look around at schools and places, and everybody knows, that there is absolutely no possible chance that any of the residence will raise a peep about them to the local security, and would probably just offer them a drink and cookies.

We expect KJ to do the same to a group of youngsters who decide to use the school vacation to stop by and take some great pictures of the historical landmarks of KJ, and have a lunch and the world renowned highly regarded eateries of Kiryas Joalle!

[tooclose2detroit]

My heart goes out for these poor innocent youngsters
Shmertzl

"The liberal sees what he wants to see, the conservative sees what is"

First of all, putz, they're not fucking "youngsters", or "kids"-youngsters and kids ride their bikes up and down my street, and play dodgeball. They are young adults!-don't try to buttress your argument, like the putz that runs this blog, by using terms to describe them to engender empathy for them-like "hikers"-Libbs cant just stick to facts without needing to arouse the heart---"your heart goes out"-no surprise there-you dont know what the hell these clowns were up to, yet you pretend that you do-Rosenberg doesnt know that they were "hikers"--I dont know what the hell they were doing, but neither do you!!!-putz.

[effie]

Someone is off his meds...

[Dovit]

They were trying to hide their misogyny. Next up for Kiryas Joel: burquas.

[tooclose2detroit]

maybe i will get some from the "youngsters" and "kids" down on 8 mile.

[mordecai]

Every cell phone now has a camera. People take pictures like breathing air and drinking water. The area is a haven for tourists or folks just getting away from the city. They are normally dressed. Taking pictures is NOT suspicious. There is no activity that is suspicious.

I find it odd that some feel that only "liberals" are against being stopped by the police. A huge number of conservatives feel the same way. The 4th Amendment is part of the Bill of Rights and transcends the idiotic liberal/conservative dichotomy.

The police already are brutal and violate the 4th Amendment at will. In my neck of the woods if you don't give the cops an ID and if you are black your head will be busted wide open.

[ah-pee-chorus]

tooclose2detroit =

did you not realize that Shmertzl was being facetious?

[Max]

tooclose2detroit:

Is now a good time to buy a house in Detroit (Orthdoox area) and move there?

Just wondering. I hear the real estate is cheap there. Are there any jobs for Orthodox?

[OMG]

Posted by: Max | August 04, 2011 at 08:42 PM

I could see 2C2D hiring you as his medical assistant, your sole focus would be to make sure that he takes the meds prescribed to him on a daily basis. We love him when he is normal, but unfortunately, there are lots more days that he forgets, to take the meds,then not.

[yawn]

yawwwn you losers bicker about such nonsense...sad state of affairs......

[george]

Did anyone notice that the video makes the claim (on behalf of the so-called hikers) that they wer eonly taking picturesz of each other. Yet the posted example on this web site seems to show that claim not to be true - anyone see any of the three so-called hikers in this photo?

[george]

The photo is all in the eye of the beholder. I do not know what age bracket the students at UTA are, so I wonder how many minors (or real children) are there. In any case, here is one alternative. Anyone wanting to sneak into the place un-observed for whatever reason, and especially under the conver of darkness, could use such pictures to plan an attack through the fence, which one assumes is the least guarded place (the open street, as the so-called hikers found out, is not so easy to sneak through).

[He Who Knows]

FYI, Witriol is licking the balls of NYS Police, he has a call number on the State Police radio 7F508 which correspond with throop F in Orange county,NY. He drives a black SUV, tinted windows,emergency lights and 7 antennas, his plate is 7F508. Witriol is imporsenating Police officers, he pulls over people and flashes them a badge, he is an unofficial Chaplin and a Public safety waana b cop with a flash light, also his conected to his butt, Shimmy Farkash the Blonde dude who terrorizes the KJ people. an investigation by the IAB is warranted.

[Morris the Katz]

George, these people were taking pictures of a sign prohibiting women. It's pretty damned obvious that's what they were up to. So take your "terrorist" bullshit and shove it.

The more this rathole, which goes against everything America stands for, is publicized, the better off the rest of the country.

[tooclose2detroit]

Is now a good time to buy a house in Detroit (Orthdoox area) and move there?

Just wondering. I hear the real estate is cheap there. Are there any jobs for Orthodox?

Posted by: Max

Max-the housing is cheap, the community is great (no child rapists, etc-they would get buried alive-or-sent to Detroit, which would, of course, be worse)-the pizza is the best in the world (jerusalem pizza), the learning opportunities are abundant, you can go watch a competitive baseball team for cheap, the weather sucks in the winter but is fine the rest of the year, you can buy drugs from youngsters or kids on 8 mile if you want-and, as far as the jobs, it really depends on what you do-feel free to contact me re more info as 2close2detroit@gmail.com for more details.

[george]

Morris the Katz

You know these people? I do not. What I know is that the video, on behalf of the so-called hikers, made assertions that are proven false by evidence displayed on this very web site.

[tooclose2detroit]

George-if these clowns would have been bothering the moslems of dearborn, the Morris and his cohorts would have said that they deserve getting beaten to a pulp (which they would have been) because they were harrasing the peaceful moslems just going about their lives-but, bother a frum jew is holy of holies.

[Korbendallas72]

In the future, everyone will be a totalitarian ass for 15 minutes.

[Tikvah]

I am suddenly reminded of the hikers that are currently in jail on unfounded charges in Iran...

[tooclose2detroit]

whaddya mean?-doesnt everyone go hiking on the Iran/Iraq border?-I thought, next to Kiryas Joel, that was second on the list of worlds greatest hikes.

[george]

Just because it was in today's news, here is one more example of what spying-out a place may be preparing for:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/1034739--flash-robs-invade-canada

And one more example of what police do:

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/article/1034612--mother-devastated-after-death-of-disabled-son?bn=1

[tooclose2detroit]

George-can you also post the golf scores?-the flash rob story, although not related to anything here, was no surprise, of course, to anyone with a brain-meaning, any conservative, of course-not sure what either story has to do with each other, or with this particular story, but as long as you are posting, please keep updating Tiger Woods and Phil Mickleson's scores from the golf tournament today.

[Morris the Katz]

George, you're a fool. If someone were a terrorist, bent upon blowing up Kiryas Joel, don't you think that person would dress to blend in with the residents?

BTW, if anyone wanted to attack Kiryas Joel, it would be a competing Satmar "Jewish" cult, not a bunch of Arabs, fundamentalist Christians, nor secular Jews.

For now, the rocks which hide KJ and New Square from the public-at-large need to be turned over to expose the scum underneath to the light.

[OMG]

Posted by: Morris the Katz | August 06, 2011 at 05:21 AM

Wow, you have the ability of rational thinking.

[george]

http://failedmessiah.typepad.com/failed_messiahcom/2011/08/arrests-in-kiryas-joel-567.html

Morris the Katz

Actually, "dressing-up" would be idiotic. Someone dressed Hassidic but who has no idea how to sound or behave Hasidic, and even if they do but make even a tiny error, would be exposed very quickly. And then it would be really obvious they were "up to something". Feigning to be innocent/clueless hikers is much better.

In any case, that is not the point. The point is that terrorists do not appear fully developed out of nowhere. There is enormous trial-and-error. Remember, for example, that attempted "shoe-bomber". Really nuts. But eventually, try enough stupid things enough times (and there are no shortage of people for that, as such things as the Gaza-flotilla or the "human shield" volunteers for Saddam Hussein, prove) and some succeed.

Especially when "early warnings" are ignored or laughed off, like you are doing.

So following is an example, relevant not only because it is the exact same topic of photography in public places, but also because this "early warning" is just plain ignored.

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/07/15/worthington-behind-the-burka

Just to be clear, Wikipedia describes the location "Yonge-Dundas Square" as follows: "opened as a public square in November 2002" (note the word "public").

The report itself only appears in a non-leftist source (non-leftist news is a clear minority), and even then only because the victim/author is himself in the profession (journalist). How many hundreds or thousands (or more?) of such similar incidents and cover-ups occur is anyone's guess.

[george]

tooclose2detroit

I don't know how serious you are or if you are being sarcastic, but just for those who might want me to state the obvious, here goes. My post was relevant because it was listing another possible motive for spying out the place. Terrorism was the extreme example (as I was just following the custom of the web site to take the extreme position), but my post pointed out that the motive for spying might be for other things as well, such as looking for something to steal, or perhaps to vanadlize.

[george]

And to be clear, the reason the link was significant, is because it shows clearly how so many do not care if they are "caught". So many deliberately looked into the camera. I suppose that "in-your-face" attitude and the risk of getting caught is all part of the "thrill".

[george]

My apologies. I posted the wrong link. The photography incident is at:

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/08/02/yonge-dundas-smackdown

[Detective (ret)]

Wow! All this back and forth bickering does not change the fact that the KJ Constable acted beyond the scope of his authority and the NYSP erroneously backed him. In the video interestingly enough I don't see the NYSP taking the ID info down only the KJ Constable... Were they trying to "Keep their hands clean"?

[What would you do.]

Food for thought I was jus reading something else and came across this tidbit August 21 is National Go-Topless Day. Can you Imagine the poor Folks in KJ and New Square would have a very interesting delima if people trying to make a point decended on these towns.there is nothing that they could do about it, not even ID' them... "A woman's right to go topless in New York has a long history. The defendants in the 1992 case People v. Ramona Santorelli and Mary Lou Schloss were arrested along with five others in a Rochester park for violating a law which prohibited women from showing "that portion of the breast which is below the top of the areola." (Areola = coloring around the nipple). Santorelli and Schloss argued that the law was "discriminatory on its face since it defines 'private or intimate parts' of a woman's but not a man's body as including a specific part of the breast." The New York Court of Appeals ruled in favor of the two women.