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March 09, 2011

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rivka

Wow!There is so much hate on this website!

Cindy

BqB8jr At last, someone comes up with the "right" answer!

A E ANDERSON | Christchurch, New Zealand

Let me clarify: adult Chabad men do not wear costumes on Purim; by custom, they wear yom tov clothing (their kapotes). That practice is obviously not confined to children, or to adults who minister/care for children, who obviously do wear costumes for educational or outreach purposes (at a Chabad House, school or carnival).

In my 6 years in Lubavitcher yeshiva, in the United States and in Israel, I never wore a costume on Purim, or saw another yeshiva student wear a costume within the the confines of the yeshiva (e.g., the yeshiva minyan).

The men in 770, or Beis Menachem/Kefar Chabad wore, as Chabad does, their Yom Tov clothing (kapote, etc.) on Purim, during Krias hamegillah. I believe that Sefer Minhagim specifically mentions the practice not to wear costumes on Purim, and if so that would mean adult men.

Chabad also doesn't sing Maoz Tsur on Hanukah; it's not even in their Siddur. That doesn't mean than many hundreds of Habad missionaries sing it when lighting their Reindeer Rule Menorot in public places, or for outreach purposes. The point is that when adhering to internal Chabad custom, it is not sung, just as costumes are not worn on Purim.

It may not seem so to the outsider in a Chabad House setting, but Lubavitch has a layer of customs interpreting Jewish law that is extremely rigid. When outsiders aren't there, they slavishly follow what they believe to be "minhad beis harav" on everything from how to hold a kiddush kup, how to inflect nusasch, how many drops to pour our during the seder at the plagues, to how to wear one's hair and clothing.

Many, but by no means all, of those customs are contained in a thick pamphlet titled "Sefer HaMinhogim," but there are many other sources of Chabad practice, written and oral, that would harldy be noticeable to somebody who hadn't spent alot of time in close proximity to these fascinating objects of study.

David

Dovit, there are plenty of ancient religions which don't treat women like something to scrape off the bottom of your shoe. The problem is that none of them is monotheistic.

Posted by: A. Nuran | March 10, 2011 at 10:33 AM

And what of the "monotheistic" ones?

gods of Chassidic Judaism: G-d + Rebbe
gods of Christianity: G-d plus Jesus
gods of Islam: Allah + moon god

A. Nuran

Dovit, there are plenty of ancient religions which don't treat women like something to scrape off the bottom of your shoe. The problem is that none of them is monotheistic.

Dovit

Sadly, this proves that all the ancient religions are really one and the same - intertwined if you will. The same radical, anti-female attitutes.

Gevezener Chusid

This is just sick.

Imagine what the little girls in the picture must think. Great for their self-esteem to know that their faces were blotted out.

The fact is the more that these people persist in this attitude, the more they will have it constantly, and perversely, on their minds.

seymour

"in the gemara they discussed having sex with 3 year olds and not one of them claimed this was a halachic problem, because it isnt. "

maybe they could not think of a halacha problem but does not mean it was ok

also at that time girls got married at 12 much younger than now I think

Mkblitz

A E ANDERSON: WoolSilkCotton:

-The most popular Purim costume for men in Crown Heights is to dress like a woman.-
-Athelion: Chabad does not traditionally dress up in costumes on Purim.-

I have spent much time in Crown Heights, and in Chabad all over, and I find both of theses statements to be incorrect.

Free Rubashkin!

B"H
you should be impressed that CHABAD doesn't blot out women or girls faces on their websites

Adam Neira

Political correctness gone completely mad.

nobody

"in the gemara they discussed having sex with 3 year olds and not one of them claimed this was a halachic problem, because it isnt. "

You are a sick person. When the nazis come for us, are you going to join them?

WoolSilkCotton

Anderson, there are plenty of photos from Crown Heights on Purim of last year, with people, including adult men who are not just idiotic baal tshuvahs, in costumes:

http://www.crownheights.info/index.php?itemid=24749

http://www.crownheights.info/index.php?itemid=24751

http://www.crownheights.info/index.php?itemid=24753

David

Something I've been wondering: What would be the reaction at a chabad Purim party if you came dressed as de rebbe?

I know someone who was contemplating just that but then considered the consequences. He would be either (a) killed or (b) be revered as the resurrected Moshiach.

A E ANDERSON | Christchurch, New Zealand

Athelion: Chabad does not traditionally dress up in costumes on Purim. It would be "Der Rebbe" and not "de Rebbe" as he remains masculine, even if decomposed.

Maven

What I don't get is that they block the girl's faces out but allow an outfit poking fun at R. Ovadiah Yosef? What paper is this ad from?

Dave

I learn something new here everyday. The legal age of consent to sex for girls in the Hasidic Cult is 3 years old. I guess a young woman is mature enough at that age. Very Talmudic.

David

I wouldn't even expect the Taliban to be this extreme.

David

The most popular Purim costume for men in Crown Heights is to dress like a woman.

Posted by: WoolSilkCotton | March 09, 2011 at 12:45 PM

An apparent halachic violation as it is prohibited to wear the clothes of the opposite sex. Oh well, I guess they make it up as they go....

ah-pee-chorus

Betzalel -

thanks for the link! its really good to hear an ortho rabbi calling out the haredi mentality as the sham which it is.

ah-pee-chorus

stickafinger init -

many haredim do not accept the 'long-day' defense and believe in 24hr days.
and as far as using that excuse for the gemara in niddah which discusses sex with a 3 year old, the gemara there asks at what age a girl can get pregnant and the answer was 12 years, so it doesnt fly there either.

Michelle

B"H

Look again, they missed some. Did they only blot out the ones that "looked Jewish" and left the blondes?

effie

theman: I see no reason to be tolerant of those who see little girls as sexual objects.

chaim

look, it just shows where these peoples heads really are.

stickafinger init

APC, 3 years old is not a problem depending upon how long each year is. It is the same way the haredim explain their belief of how HaShem could create the world in a six days: "well, we don't really know how long one of HaShem's days were."

Where there is a will there is an explanation.

Jeff

I'm confused. There are two little girls in the second row, center. Why didn't they block out their faces - because they're blond, and therefore obviously shiksas?

WoolSilkCotton

The most popular Purim costume for men in Crown Heights is to dress like a woman.

FM Fan

IT's not that they blotted out the faces, it's that the frummies doing the graphics work cut out the faces to masturbate over...

Aleksandr Sigalov

Deuteronomy 32:28

For they are a nation void of counsel, neither is there any understanding in them.

‏כִּי־ג֛וֹי אֹבַ֥ד עֵצ֖וֹת הֵ֑מָּה וְאֵ֥ין בָּהֶ֖ם תְּבוּנָֽה

jay

It is written in the Mishnah: “A girl of three years and one day is betrothed (as a woman is acquired) by intercourse…if one of those forbidden to have relations with her according to the Torah does have relations with her, he is killed because of her, and she is exempt. If she is younger than that, (less than three years and a day), it is as one who sticks a finger in the eye”
Mishnah Niddah 5:4

from:
http://rabbimichaelsamuel.com/2010/04/the-conspiracy-of-silence/#more-6622

zibble

theman ignores the simple fact that there is nothing un-tznius about the face. Or perhaps he uses Bruria Keren as his posek...

A. Nuran

Disappear them.
Make them invisible.
Throw them down the memory hole.

The Tallitban learned Stalin's lessons well. The only thing wrong with Uncle Joe, they'd say, is that the Jews were the fuckees instead of the fuckers.

ah-pee-chorus

theman - do you know which daf ?

jay

That's the problem. There's obviously a need to boycott publications that do this sort of nonsense as well as businesses that enable it.

Garnel Ironheart

The problem with advertising is that to maximize your customer base you have to avoid offending anyone. If this company didn't blot out the girls' faces there would be whackjobs out there screaming "pritzus" and taking their money elsewhere. However, it's unlikely they'll lose any business if they do blot out the faces.

Betzalel

See http://www.koshertorah.com/openforum.htm

Click on the link

"J'ACCUSE!! Confronting "Haredi" Hypocrisy
and what we can do to fix it!"

The first Orthodox rabbi I've heard who has confronted these types of issues head on.

theman

the gemorah in kiddushin and niddah discuss the age of yichud and niggiah...the strict opinion is 3 years old....most people i know dont observe this position. again--i agree that it is extreme.

Betzalel

This is the Erev Rav. They have infiltrated the Torah community.

ah-pee-chorus

theman-
WHAT IS THE TORAH SOURCE FOR THIS???

ah-pee-chorus

i think that everyone needs to be able to be a bit tolerant

dont try to morally equate the positions of those that want to control what others do with those who refuse to have their freedoms curtailed by religious nuts.
i dont have to be tolerant of those who would tell me how i may dress, what i may sell in my restaurant or where i may drive on shabbos.

theman

it is an extreme view. and you are correct that they expect others to accept it.
i think that everyone needs to be able to be a bit tolerant

ah-pee-chorus

tniyus starts at the age of 3 according to the strict opinion.... whats the big deal

Posted by: theman | March 09, 2011 at 10:40 AM


what is the source from the torah? in the gemara they discussed having sex with 3 year olds and not one of them claimed this was a halachic problem, because it isnt. and yet now the same halachic mesora is supposed to require covering faces in pictures??!!
the PROBLEM is that these jewliban have created a new religion and demand that others follow suit.

notsofrumjew

what about all the rabbis attracted to boys? maybe those faces should be blocked also.

the usual chaim

althelion - everyone already dresses like the rebbe every shabbat. you'd fit right in

jay

Since when is a woman's face supposed to be obliterated? You call that tniyus? It's extremist radicalism.

theman

its very simple--- tniyus starts at the age of 3 according to the strict opinion.... whats the big deal

Althelion

Something I've been wondering: What would be the reaction at a chabad Purim party if you came dressed as de rebbe?

Althelion

Maybe this is a reflection of the personal sexual desires of hareidi leaders.

Note to those hareidi leaders: The problem is you - NOT little girls

curiousity

That's just sad!

Yochanan Lavie

It would be more effective to blot out the faces of the little boys.

Monsey

If they blotted the penises off child molesters then they would be doing us a real service

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