NY State To Terminate Kosher Food Inspectors Next Year

The new year won't be happy for New York State's kosher food inspectors, as Gov. David Paterson decided this month to terminate them as of Jan. 1, 2011, as part of an effort to trim a budget deficit that will probably exceed $10 billion next fiscal year.

State To Terminate Kosher Food Inspectors In 2011
Forest Hills Politician Says Plan Will Weaken Tradition
By Rob MacKay * Forest Hills Patch

The new year won't be happy for New York State's kosher food inspectors, as Gov. David Paterson decided this month to terminate them as of Jan. 1, 2011, as part of an effort to trim a budget deficit that will probably exceed $10 billion next fiscal year.

Paterson plans to slash about 95 percent of funding for the Division of Kosher Law Enforcement, which is part of the state's agriculture department. Currently, the state employs eight kosher food inspectors who carry out about 5,000 inspections a year, examing roughly 3,000 food sellers and manufacturers. All eight will lose their jobs.

Kosher food stores on 108th Street predicted that the lack of inspectors won't change their way of doing business. Jerry William, who manages Chai Kosher Meat & Poultry, explained that his store already has a rabbi who makes sure the products meet kosher requirements. "They [the inspectors] just oversee what our rabbi does," he said.

However, local politicians and other members of the observant Jewish community railed against the decision, claiming that the state will lose its ability to ensure the integrity of kosher products, thus weakening kosher traditions and respect for kosher law.

"These cuts would undoubtedly mean that untrained Agriculture and Markets inspectors would monitor kosher food, resulting in little or no protection from fraudulent products," said State Sen. Toby Ann Stavisky. "Who is going to make sure that hot dogs containing pork products don't wind up next to the Hebrew National ones?"

Senator Stavisky then added: "Eliminating the kosher food unit would save approximately $800,000. Are we really to believe that this is going to help close a budget deficit of almost $10 billion?"

The National Council for Young Israel, the coordinating agency for roughly 150 Orthodox Jewish congregations throughout the U.S. and Canada, has joined the Rabbinical Alliance of America, a group with more than 850 rabbi members in the U.S., in issuing a call to the Jewish community to fight Paterson's decision. 

There are about 82,000 kosher-certified products for sale in New York State, which is the world's largest manufacturer and consumer of kosher products outside of Israel. The state has enforced kosher inspections since 1915.

Comments

[yidandahalf]

Why would the state need an "...ability to ensure the integrity of ko$her products..." in a country that SUPPOSEDLY has legalized the separation of church and state. How many more of these religious parasites (of every faith) are living off the taxpayers?

[Yirmiyahu]

The Kosher inspection program has its genesis in the NY of the early 20th Century when Kashrut standards were extremely lax among purveyors of "Kosher" food and the owners of "Kosher" restaurants. The basis for the existence of state sponsored Kosher inspection has always been "truth in advertising" rather than enforcement of religious law.

[Larry Lennhoff]

Who is going to make sure that hot dogs containing pork products don't wind up next to the Hebrew National ones?"
Who among the frum community would eat either, and who among the non-frum community would be so insanely machmir as to care whether sealed cold kosher products were adjacent to sealed cold treif ones?

[SJ]

So unlike what the propagandists say, ko$her inspections actually do cost $$$$$$$$$. O.O

[Yoel Mechanic]

>legalized the separation of church and state.

The constitution actually does not quite say "separate church and state"; rather it is an exclusion clause that the state may not pass any law that establishes a religion, or prevents the free practice of a religion. apparently the kosher inspectors were legal and constitutional as they are not establishing a religion. "separation of church and state" is sort of a slogan that stands for a very complex set of precedents based on the first amendment. In actual fact there is a very rich interaction between church and state over tax exemptions, and many other issues. Certainly for the student of legal history, worth studying

[jay]

The reason why the Orthodox rabbinate is up in arms is because the state intervention in kosher law allowed them to prevent non-Orthodox kosher certifications from establishing a market. In reality, the state was sponsoring one religious denomination to the exclusion of others.

[David]

The State should not be involved in kashrut supervision for many reasons. Good decision.

[Bassy the Haredi Slayer]

Why Young Israel is joining a crazy guy like Yehuda Levin and his the Rabbinical Alliance of America

[Yerachmiel Lopin]

I wonder if the issue is that the 8 inspection jobs are employment for orthodox Jews?

Can the state really choose among different hechsherim? My sense is that this would violate the establishment clause because it would involve the state as a posek about what is kosher.

I am completely sympathetic to the state prosecuting labelling fraud where someone slaps on OU on a product when the product is not certified by OU.

Does anyone have the actual language of the law governing this program?

[Cons. Rabbi]

Shalom All! I'm a Conservative rabbi who supervises a bakery in NY State, so I have some first-hand knowledge of how this works. The State does not choose hechsherim at all, but rather every place that calls itself kosher has to submit paperwork about who supervises the kashrut and what that person's qualifications are. That goes on a database which is searchable on the internet, so if you don't trust a Conservative rabbi (obviously, many don't), then you don't buy from that bakery.

What the kosher inspectors do (did) is make sure that there are no obviously non-kosher ingredients in the establishment and that the business is run according to the supervisor's standards. That is, where there are differences of kashrut practice, they don't enforce one over the other, but they help reinforce the local supervisor's standards.

The State inspectors have always been courteous and very professional with me and the bakery I supervise. I am sorry to see them go, but I understand the Governor's decision.

Keep up the good work, Shmarya.

[ah-pee-chorus]

since "kosher" is not a health claim and is purely a religious term, the state should never have had any involvement other than to ensure there has been no fraud in using a trademark of one of the kosher supervision agencies. any food maker should have the right to call whatever they like kosher and it isnt the governments place to be involved in determining what that means. if a food says "under the supervision of ...." then the state should deal with instances of fraud and deception just as they would if a ketchup called itself "heinz" when it wasnt.

[Yoel Mechanic]

>I wonder if the issue is that the 8 inspection jobs are employment for orthodox Jews?

What makes you presume that this NYS government inspector job was "for" orthodox Jews, or reserved for orthodox Jews (as your wording suggests) ? I know you have this worded as a question, but perhaps a little more careful wording, or prior research is in order before making something that appears to be an insinuating statement.

[A. Nuran]

It's years past time. This program was an unconstitutional establishment of religion and used public money to enforce particular religious beliefs on people.

[What kind of goyishe name is Harold z"l?]

So just to be sure - Does this mean that non-kosher is now legal in NY and can be had by all?

[WoolSilkCotton]

So these kosher inspectors were inspecting the mashgichim? Inspectors for the inspectors? And you wonder why NY State has a budget deficit?

[william e emba]

The kashrus inspection law was about fraud, not kashrus as such. An agency would claim they were kosher at such-and-such a level, that they only allowed glatt meat or not, that they inspected a site so-often-a-week, and so on. The state's job was simply to check that they delivered what they promised on a certain checklist of issues. The state did not care what the level of kashrus was, just that the agencies practiced what they preached, and that the consumer had some idea of what they were getting.

I once saw a state checklist posted on a wall in one NJ restaurant. It was rather ironic: the place was R&R Deli in Lakewood, where the proprietor was known to be more knowledgeable and strict and God-fearing than anyone in any kashrus agency.

Of course, everyone who voted Republican is celebrating the cutback. Just like they're celebrating all those maximum-sentence tough-on-crime Federal judges out there!

[william e emba]

WSC: The various mashgichim are a private expense, ultimately paid for by the kosher consumer. The state inspectors of the inspectors are a public expense, ultimately paid for by all New Yorkers.

[WoolSilkCotton]

William, thanks for the info.

NJ relies on the checklist posting, as you know. The consumer has to rely on the name and reputation of the mashgiach, and if they don't know him, they need to ask their rabbi if he knows him. The NJ consumer also has to decide whether the merchant/restauranteur is someone they can trust. NY, as you mentioned, took it the extra step to see if the merchant was obeying his own claims.

The deli you mentioned is a good example of a place where consumers can feel confident about the kashrus; such a merchant shouldn't even need a mashgiach. Under NJ law, he doesn't, as long as he posts what his criteria for calling himself 'kosher' is.

Meanwhile, if you're in NJ tonight, stay warm, and have a nice deli sandwich with a glass of hot tea!

[william e emba]

WSC: I'm told that R&R Deli did not have official supervision at first. It is a basic halakha that commercially prepared food needs some kind of outside supervision, and the rav allowed the local Vaad to visit and inspect at any time, but if someone had doubts or even questions about anything he did, well, he knew the relevant halakha and rulings of poskim far better than anyone who asked, or their rabbaim. And there was something deeply impressive about seeing him out front with his lens going over the cabbage and lettuce on a light table in slow motion, a small piece at a time. I mean, if you're going to trust Big Name Kashrus Agency that allows a good wash or something just as lazy, or that fires its whistleblowers, or whatever, then how on earth can you have qualms with this place?

[Dave]

The inspectors were a sinecure.

Look, under New York State Law, I can register a Hechsher, and sell "Kosher Bacon" (made from actual pork), and there is not a thing that these "inspectors" could do about it.

All I have to do is register my standards, and adhere to them, and I can call anything I want Kosher.

[WoolSilkCotton]

William, I look forward to stopping by that deli sometime for lunch!

Dave, kashrus ultimately becomes a matter of trusting the merchant or his hechsher, whether or not a government agency puts their approval on it or not. Government kashrus inspectors can only do occasional spot checks, at best.
Kosher consumers, like people who buy any product or service where you can't easily see if the product is what it's supposed to be (eg. 'organic', 'low fat') need to remain educated and aware of who the merchant and the manufacturer are.

[william e emba]

Indeed it is trust all the way.

I gave up all Lubavitch hechshirim for anything about ten years ago. I gave up Rubashkin (which had an OU) about five or six years ago, long before the current issues. L'khathila--if someone is serving the stuff, I'll eat it without the least indication of disapproval.

I once was in a cholov yisroel pizzeria when I saw one of the (Jewish, kippah-wearing) workers go across the street and return with a cholov stam gallon of milk. I hold by cholov stam, but I never ate there again, or at the owner's other restaurant.

I once ran an errand in the afternoon erev Pesach and passed by a restaurant that was open, doing heavy business. I thought--of course you're supposed to think good things--that it was an arrangement with a goy. I doublechecked after Pesach with the rav, and he said, in a rather unhappy voice, that there was no such arrangement. I never returned.

[william e emba]

Dave: so what?

Under the NY system, you and your kosher bacon are upfront about what your product is, and customers like me stay away. It seems mutually fair.

The point of the law is to make things difficult to impossible for Evad, your Evil Twin Brother, from selling the bacon as kosher according to a standard that customers like me expect.

There was a Philadelphia area controversy about ten years ago regarding somebody's meats. It took me a week to find out what the issue was: they held that the meat did not need to be salted and rinsed within three days, since it was frozen. Ah, at that point I could find out where I held.

Frankly, it is ridiculous that neither I nor my rav has much of any idea what goes on under most kashrus supervision. Between being technically ignorant of commercial-scale food manufacture, the actual standards are borderline trade secrets. The point of the NJ/NY laws is that some of these issues are public information, and independently verified to a small bit. Secretly breaking the standards becomes an act of fraud the state has an interest in, instead of a religious squabble the state can't touch. On the downside, the agency can no longer make certain b'dieved rulings. That's part of the price when trust fails.

An OU rabbi told me what happened at the infamous OU meeting after the one OU rav who knew the Coca-Cola secret recipe retired, and Coke told the OU they weren't going to let any new rav in on the recipe, so Triangle-K got the new contract. Of course everyone agreed the stuff was still kosher--they were serving the sodas at the meeting!--but there was protocol. OU restaurants had to switch to Pepsi, the OU agreed to certify for Pesach!! and the like. A complete mess, and certainly no one liked the decisions. People trusted Coca-Cola more than the rabbaim? Egads!

Eventually, a compromise was found: Coca-Cola let the OU know the ingredients to all their sodas combined, and the OU checked that only that stuff was brought to the plants.