Rabbi Suspended After Demanding Dummy Modesty

Demanded "naked" mannequins be fully and modestly clothed.

Tiberias Official Suspended after Demanding Dummy Modesty 
by Gil Ronen

(IsraelNN.com) The Mayor of Tiberias (Tverya) has ordered the suspension of Rabbi Refael Cohen, Head of Kashrut Department in the Religious Council, after Cohen issued a directive to clothing shops to cover “naked” mannequins in their shopfront windows.

Cohen recently distributed a letter to numerous clothing shops in Tiberias, instructing them to remove photographs of scantily clad models and dress the unclothed mannequins on display in their front windows as well.

Cohen said that by promoting immodesty, these stores hurt religious residents’ feelings and also “cause great sorrow to the tzaddikim [righteous holy people – ed.] who are buried in the city.”

According to a report in Ma’ariv Wednesday, Cohen threatened to publish a list of stores that insist on immodest displays, and said that shopping in such stores would cause “irreversible damage” to residents of Tiberias. "Modest" mannequins are all right, he explained, “But there are mannequins that are really revolting, mannequins in bathing suits that damage our souls."

He added that "obscene photographs" showing models in swimsuits or underwear "elicit sorrow among the passers-by on the road."

Mayor gets angry
When Tiberias Mayor Zohar Oved got wind of the matter on Wednesday, he spoke with the Head of the Religious Council, Yaakov Sheetrit, and called for Cohen to be suspended.

“I deplore Rabbi Cohen’s strange actions, which upset the delicate balance between the city’s different sectors,” Oved said. “Tiberias is an international tourist city,” he added, “and as such it contains tourist zones which operate peacefully alongside neighborhoods with a religious character.”

“The bond between religious and secular in the city is a close one and I will not allow a rabbi acting as he pleases and with no support, to upset it,” he declared.

By Thursday he had gotten his wish, and Cohen was suspended.

The Tiberias Municipality termed Cohen’s recent statements and actions, which include a demand for greater adherence to kashrut in the city’s businesses, as “unilateral actions that do not have the backing of the Religious Council.”

Cohen aroused controversy a few months ago, and even received alleged death threats, when he called for a boycott of the Big Shopping Center because it is open on Saturdays.

Previous Post.

[Hat Tip: Michelle.]

Comments

[Yochanan Lavie]

Yossid is going to call this a blood libel.

[Archie Bunker]

Ok, so now we know these were not food establishments.

But people have a right to call for a boycott of stores that desecrate the Sabbath. Is there is a criminal investigation into the seculars making death threats?

[ML]

Alleged death threats are not actual death threats. Likely they are about as big an exaggeration as the rest of the nonsense coming from this Rabbi's mouth.

[Archie Bunker]

Yes this rabbi is so horrible for opposing sexy objects. Now let's see Shmarya & company bash these all-American "Taliban" types. (Don't hold your breath).

http://news.aol.com/article/bbq-owner-told-to-cover-up-mannequin/457719

READING, Ohio (May 14) - A curvaceous, scantily clad mannequin can keep her spot outside a Cincinnati area barbecue joint, but local officials want her to cover up a bit.

The life-size figure stands as a busty beacon outside a restaurant in suburban Reading owned by Kenny Tessel. He told zoning officials at a hearing Wednesday night that the advertising gimmick has boosted business 40 percent.

The 5-foot-10 mannequin is on the street wearing a bikini top and tight short-shorts, leading some residents to complain about her lack of clothing. Tessel brought the doll to Wednesday's hearing draped in a long, sleeveless gray T-shirt.
The board said Tessel may continue to use the figure only if it's dressed more modestly in front of the restaurant, too.

He plans to appeal.

[MisterApikoros]

You don't mess with the Zohar.

[ML]

I support this guy and his appeal as well.

But since that article has nothing to do with Jews, Judaism, or Israel, it really wouldn't be within the scope of this blog to necessary discuss it.

How about knocking off the cutting and pasting already. We can follow a link, dude.

[Archie Bunker]

It does have to do with a question of bad taste / morality, Jewish or not, something that is alien to many readers here.

[ML]

I thought you were the big freedom of expression champion, Archie?

[MisterApikoros]

The difference is that this mannequin was OUTSIDE the store, and used as advertising for the store's unkosher products, meaning I'll pay them a visit if I'm ever in the area.

Nevertheless, I regard the town council's actions as ridiculously puritanical, but this is Cincinnati, where the Cincinnati Reds were once called the "Redlegs" back in the '50's for fear that Ted Kluszewski, Gus Bell, and Frank Robinson might be labeled as communists.

[Archie Bunker]

And stop your whining, ML. There's no rule against pasting short snippets.

[ML]

Pot...kettle....black....FTW!

[Dr. Dave]

Archie-
Why not just use the "href" tag to provide a live link?

[Archie Bunker]

How do you place a hyperlink in a blog post?

[Dr. Dave]

This will tell you how to do it (I may regret doing this):

W3Schools.com

[maven]

Arch writes: It does have to do with a question of bad taste / morality, Jewish or not, something that is alien to many readers here.

This is totally correct. We depend on you for expertise on bad taste (and mauvaise foi), as I like to think I have more expertise with regards to good taste and morality.

[Yochanan Lavie]

What's the Frequency Archie (apologies: REM)

"What's the frequency, Archie?" is your venom, oy vey
He was gei in dred, locked out, banned, not up to speed
I thought I'd blogged you an idiot's dream
Torah vision from the apikorus's screen
I never understood his frequency, oy vey
You wore our expectations like a shaatnes suit, uh-huh

I'd studied your postings, rants, musings, invectives, parodies
Shmarya said, "Withdrawal in disgust is not the same as apathy"
A smile like Rav Elyashiv, shain tachat shain
You said that davening was the shuckling of pain
You wore tzitzit of violent tachelet, oy vey I never understood the frequency, oy vey

"What's the frequency, Archie?" is your Ben-Adam, oy vey
Moshiach decal, rear-view hindsight, blogging the scene
You smile like the Rebbe, truth for a truth
You said that heresy was the shackles of youth
You wore tzitzit of violent tachelet , oy vey
I never understood the frequency, oy vey
You wore out expectations like a black kapoteh suit, oy vey
I couldn't understand
You said that heresy was the shackles of abuse, oy vey
I couldn't understand
You wore a shirt of Soylent green, oy vey
I couldn't understand
I never understood, don't shtup with me, oy vey

[DK]

In fact, the rabbi is right to be concerned. In the documentary,"Borat," the subject actually attempted to waste his seed while staring at a female mannequin.

I think this proves rather incontrovertibly that men are turned on by mannequins.

[Chicago Samson]

Yes, I read the article and of course, I anticipated your reaction. Two wrongs don't make a right. If this case goes to the Supreme Court, there can be little doubt how they would rule.

Christian fundamentalists, like their Haredi and Taliban cousins, are both cut from the same cloth.

++READING, Ohio (May 14) - A curvaceous, scantily clad mannequin can keep her spot outside a Cincinnati area barbecue joint, but local officials want her to cover up a bit.

The life-size figure stands as a busty beacon outside a restaurant in suburban Reading owned by Kenny Tessel. He told zoning officials at a hearing Wednesday night that the advertising gimmick has boosted business 40 percent.

The 5-foot-10 mannequin is on the street wearing a bikini top and tight short-shorts, leading some residents to complain about her lack of clothing. Tessel brought the doll to Wednesday's hearing draped in a long, sleeveless gray T-shirt.
The board said Tessel may continue to use the figure only if it's dressed more modestly in front of the restaurant, too.++

[Yochanan Lavie]

Actually, DK, most of us like womanequins.

[Chicago Samson]

++I think this proves rather incontrovertibly that men are turned on by mannequins.++

Oh please, men are turned on by all sorts of things, holes in the wall, liver, you name it--you can find a perversion for the male organ.

It's not about the mannequin, silly, men are aroused more by the thought have having sex. That is probably the most important reason why these biblical prohibitions exist in the first place. Are we going to impose a law requiring women to wear burkas too, to prevent men from arousal? That's really absurd.

[maven]

Um, ChiSam, are you saying that you get turned on by liver? You can't come to my house for the Friday night meal. I hate to hear what you might do with the gefülte fish.

[A. Nuran]

CS, are you related to Alexander Portnoy?

[C-G]

I'm really glad I don't eat liver.

[Yochanan Lavie]

If the rabbis go ballistic for dummy modesty, then people will conclude that modesty is for dummies. (I know that sounds like a book).

[Chicago Samson]

Sorry Maven, that's not for me; I'm afraid I wouldn't know how, but given your extensive medical background and exposure to worldly cultures, you are more than welcome to give us a demonstration.

I personally have better things to do with my time.

[maven]

CS: huh? you were the one who found liver to be erotic...

[Avis Johnson]

I will miss this story b/c it was so absurd yet generated such passionate comments. But it was almost my undoing.... my compadres complained they could no longer tolerate endless renditions (in my own voice) of "Dummy Woman" ...I pleaded special dispensation since I am female but to no avail. They also ban "Bean eater" and "Invisiable Girl" but are o.k with "Brown Shushan"

[Chicago Samson]

The Gemora in Avodah Zarah 22b-23a has an entire discussion of this topic. The Misnah reads (based on Jacob Neusner's new translation.)

I A They do not leave cattle in gentiles’ inns,
B because they are suspect in regard to bestiality.
II C And a woman should not be alone with them,
D because they are suspect in regard to fornication.
III E And a man should not be alone with them,
F because they are suspect in regard to bloodshed.

Here is the Gemora:

A. [22B] [With regard to the rule, They do not leave cattle in gentiles’ inns,
because they are suspect in regard to bestiality], an objection was raised:
They purchase from [gentiles] cattle for an offering, and need not scruple
on the count of [the gentile’s having practiced] bestiality [with it] or
suffered bestiality [from it], or having set aside the beast for idolatrous
worship, or having actually worshiped [the beast] [T. A.Z. 1:1G-H].

B. Now with respect to the considerations of the beast’s having been set aside for
idolatrous worship, or having actually been worshiped, there is no problem about our not taking account of such a possibility, since, if the owner had actually designated it for that purpose or actually worshiped it, the owner would never have sold it. But why not take account of the possibility of [the gentile’s having practiced] bestiality [with it] or suffered bestiality
[from it]?

C. Said R. Tahalipa said R. Shila bar Abina in the name of Rab, “The gentile is
concerned that his beast not be made barren” [Mishcon: so the passage does
not suspect immoral practice in the case of the heathen’s own cattle, while our
Mishnah, which deals with other people’s cattle left in a heathen’s inn, does
suspect it].

D. Well, that serves for the case of female cattle, but as to the males, what is to be said?

E. Said R. Kahana, “The consideration is that sexual relations with the male have a
deteriorating affect upon the flesh.”

F. Then what about that which has been taught on Tannaite authority: One may buy
cattle from a gentile shepherd. But should one not take account of the
possibility that he has had sexual relations with the beast?

G. The gentile shepherd would be concerned not to lose his salary.

AND IT GETS EVEN STRANGER!

A. [22B] [With regard to the rule, They do not leave cattle in gentiles’ inns,
because they are suspect in regard to bestiality], an objection was raised:
They purchase from [gentiles] cattle for an offering, and need not scruple
on the count of [the gentile’s having practiced] bestiality [with it] or
suffered bestiality [from it], or having set aside the beast for idolatrous
worship, or having actually worshipped [the beast] [T. A.Z. 1:1G-H].

B. Now with respect to the considerations of the beast’s having been set aside for
idolatrous worship, or having actually been worshiped, there is no problem about our not taking account of such a possibility, since, if the owner had actually designated it for that purpose or actually worshiped it, the owner would never have sold it. But why not take account of the possibility of [the gentile’s having practiced] bestiality [with it] or suffered bestiality [from it]?

C. Said R. Tahalipa said R. Shila bar Abina in the name of Rab, “The gentile is
concerned that his beast not be made barren” [Mishcon: so the passage does
not suspect immoral practice in the case of the heathen’s own cattle, while our
Mishnah, which deals with other people’s cattle left in a heathen’s inn, does
suspect it].

D. Well, that serves for the case of female cattle, but as to the males, what is to be
said?

E. Said R. Kahana, “The consideration is that sexual relations with the male have a
deteriorating affect upon the flesh.”

F. Then what about that which has been taught on Tannaite authority: One may buy
cattle from a gentile shepherd. But should one not take account of the possibility that he has had sexual relations with the beast?

G. The gentile shepherd would be concerned not to lose his salary.

H. Then what about that which has been taught on Tannaite authority: And they do
not hand over cattle to their shepherds
[T. A.Z. 3:2]? Why not claim here,
too, The gentile shepherd would be concerned not to lose his salary?

I. They who are well informed among themselves would be so concerned, but we, who are not informed about what they do, would not be a cause of concern to them.

J. Said Rabbah, “That is in line with what people say: ‘As the stylus penetrates the stone, so one smartass knows another.’”

K. In that case, we should not buy male cattle from women, for we should take
account of the possibility that they have had sexual relations with the beast?

L. Since the beast would then follow the woman around, she would be concerned [and
not do so].

M. Then what about that which R. Joseph repeated as a Tannaite statement, “A widow
should not raise dogs, nor rent a room to a disciple of a master as her guest”? There is no problem in the matter of the disciple, since she could rely on his modesty, but as to the dog, why not invoke the principle that she would be afraid of the dog’s following her around?

N. Since a dog would follow around someone who threw it a piece of meat, people
would suppose that the dog followed her because she had given it pieces of
meat.

I.2 A. [Moving on to the rule, And a woman should not be alone with them, because they are suspect in regard to fornication], and why not leave female animals alone with female gentiles?

B. Said Mar Uqba bar Hama, “Because gentiles spend a lot of time hanging around with their neighbors’ wives, and if, by chance, the gentile would not find the wife but should find a cow, he might just as well have sexual relations with the cow.”

C. You may say that, even if he finds the wife, he would just as well use the cow, for a master has said, “They prefer Israelites’ cows to their own wives.”

I.3 A. For said R. Yohanan, “When the snake had sexual relations with
Eve, he dropped into her a filthy drop [of lust].”

B. If so, the same consideration should apply to Israelites?

C. Since the Israelites stood at Mount Sinai, their lust came to an end, but since the gentiles did not stand at Mount Sinai, their lust did not come to an end.

I.4 A. The question was raised: What about birds? [Do gentiles have sexual relations with chickens too?]

B. Come and take note, for said R. Judah said Samuel in the name of R. Hanina, “I myself saw a gentile buy a goose in the market, have sexual relations with it, strangle it, roast it, and then eat it.”

C. And said R. Jeremiah of Difti, “I myself saw an Arab buy a side of beast
in the market, pierce it so as to have sexual relations.

[Chicago Samson]

++The Gemora in Avodah Zarah 22b-23a has an entire discussion on this topic.

BTW, I want to raise some interesting questions. How would Freud interpret this kind of passage?

Is it possible that such discussions might have led to anti-Semitism, especially because of the way gentiles are depicted? Obviously, who ever wrote this Talmudic section definitely didn't like gentiles.

If you want to understand a Haredi, you must learn how to think like one first.

[Yochanan Lavie]

Avis: thanks for your appreciation.

[Chicago Samson]

++CS: huh? you were the one who found liver to be erotic...++

For a man who appears to be reasonably intelligent, you apparently doesn't know how to critically read; or perhaps you seem to get your jollies at the expense of others. Either way, you are not funny; your comment is quite rude.

Note that I did not speak in the first person; I t was commenting about male behavior. God gave you a brain, Maven, try using it a bit better.

VaHaMaven Yaskil

[Chicago Samson]

One more note.

Maven, I always try to treat every person here in this forum respectfully--whether I agree with that person or not.

I really expect the same kind of reciprocal behavior from you. Being a mentsch involves acknowledging when you mess up; I have taken ownership for those expressing words that accidentally offended others, if you consider yourself an ethical person, you need to do the same.

Shabbat Shalom

[Chicago Samson]

Oops, accidentally pressed the wrong button again!

One more note.

Maven, I always try to treat every person here in this forum respectfully--whether I agree with that person or not.

I really expect the same kind of reciprocal behavior from you. Being a mentsch involves acknowledging when you mess up; I have taken ownership for expressing words that may have accidentally offended others, if you consider yourself an ethical person, you need to do the same.

Shabbat Shalom

[maven]

CS: What are you talking about? If anything, your line about the demonstration and your "time" was an insult, everyone else was just kidding around, because of your line with the liver.
And why a silly joke about gefulte fish makes me an unethical person, well, I suppose I don't have the training or eduaction you have.

[Chicago Samson]

Ok, I accept your words; my apologies as well.

I casually commented about male sexual behavior and eroticism because of the Gemora I recall studying decades ago.

Shalom in Yisrael.

[MisterApikoros]

I, Mr. Apikoros, am the real Arnold Portnoy (and you thought Philip Roth's novel was semi-autobiographical).

From personal experience, I know that veal liver is far more homoerotic than cow's liver. What beats (pun intended) both, however, is a vacuum cleaner hose.

[MisterApikoros]

I have a problem with a secular mayor telling a synagogue to fire a rabbi, no matter how stupid the rabbi is.

Can you imagine all the shit that would hit the fan if Mayor Bloomberg (who's a non-practicing Jew) called the Pope and told him to fire Cardinal Timothy Dolan of the New York Archdiocese because the mayor disagreed with Dolan's position on abortion?

[MisterApikoros]

Re: Chicago Samson's discussion of the Mishnah:

I am far from a learned Torah scholar, and have no desire to become one. But after reading this excerpt, I now better understand why all these Yeshiva bochers immersed themselves so deeply.

It's the sex, stupid.

[SJ]

>> The Mayor of Tiberias (Tverya) has ordered the suspension of Rabbi Refael Cohen, Head of Kashrut Department in the Religious Council, after Cohen issued a directive to clothing shops to cover “naked” mannequins in their shopfront windows.

Thank goodness for some sanity.

[A. Nuran]

Mr. Aporikos, that was way too much information.

[Chicago Samson]

Over Shabbat, I gave a shi'ur after lunch to my ba'ale batim from the Torah Le'Da'at halachic drashot on the parsha.

I chose to speak about the section dealing with on'at dibburim, and I mentioned how sometimes words cause pain--even when said in jest, how much more so when the offended party retaliates with emotion and not with sechel.

So, once again, I want to make it clear to Maven that I am apologizing for overreacting to a joke. The stress of the job left me earlier feeling somewhat upset for reasons I cannot get into; when emotions cloud the mind, sometimes people respond with a knee-jerk retort, which in this case was completely unnecessary--even stupid and foolish. Nobody is responsible for what another says or does, we are only responsible for how we react.

Therefore, I am taking ownership for anything I said that shouldn't have been said in the first place.

=====================================

On a positive note, the discussion reminded me of a sugiya I studied and decided to look up the Gemorah. I type very quickly (about 100 words per minute); ergo, so please forgive me if I did not transcribe the material adequately.

Now with respond to Mister Apikorus's insightful comment, "It's the sex, stupid," he is totally correct. You may recall the movie, "A Stranger Among Us," how the young rabbi spoke about lovemaking to the lovely police officer, because that's how yeshiva students have sublimated their eroticism for many centuries.

Take the Vilna Gaon for an example; while it is true he studied almost 24 hours a day, what you don't know is that he sired pretty close to twenty children--I know, I was once married to his great-great-great,etc. - grand-daughter. I give him a lot of credit for having a healthy libod--it ran in the family, I might add. In her case, well .... that's a whole another story that some of you here at FM might be able to better relate to.

Haredi behavior makes sense when you realize the unhealthy psychological world they inhabit. In Jungian terms, they are completely blindsided by their "shadow," which is the uncivilized part of our soul we try to hide at all cost. More often than not, like a lid of a boiling pot, eventually the heat of the pot will cause the lid to fly off because of the accumulated pressure ...

[mordecai]

Hmmmm dead Tzaddechim are offended. That is a new one.

Let us analyze this concept of the Tzaddech. We learn that we enter the world with nothing and leave with nothing. We learn from Proverbs that man may be wise only in his own eyes. We learn from Koheleth that we strive after wind when seeking all manners of "wisdon" as wisdom comes from G-D.

Yet Rabbinic Judaism creates gradations wherein who are the Tzaddecks? Well you guessed it! They are the rabbis themselves. They are Tzaddecks and the rest of us are peasant Jews, proletariat Jews, pedestrian Jews, and the unlearned mass of Jews. After all a life that is not engaged in Torah study cannot be a life that has been uplifted from the dusty gutter.

I propose a notion for meditation. Many of the "Tzaddecks" have contributed to the annihilation of the Jews. Rabbi Akiba surely was a Tzaddeck. He and other "Tzaddecks" lent support to Bar Kochba. As a consequence of this rebellion hundreds of thousands of Jews were slaughtered by the Romans and the rest were either sentenced to a life of slavery or tossed out of Judea.

The Romans may have been a nasty group and some of the Emperors like Caligula were insance. But for the most part a dispassionate study of history shows that they only wanted cooperation from their conquered territories and generally did not get involved with local beliefs. In fact they accorded those conquered territories much freedom and many were given roman citizenship. From time to time craziness occurrred like the issue with putting the emperors statue in the temple.

Had cooler heads prevailed the issue would have disappeared in short time and hundreds of thousands of Jews would not have perished and the remainder not tossed out of Judea.

It is quite ironic that now under the new religion of Schneerson-anity his picture is in the shul proper of the many Chabad shuls. For example in Miami Beach on Alton Rd (Chabad Florida Headquarters) the picture of the Messiah (Schneerson-- not Obama) is on the Tzedduckah box just 6 feet from the Torah in the shul itself and not in the lobby or other office.

How ironic that one Tzaddeck helped annihilate us because they did not want an image in the shul and other "Tzaddecks" want to annuhilate Judaism by putting images in the shul. GO FIGURE!!!!!

[Chicago Samson]

How large is the tsedakah box?

[Yoel B]

mannequins in bathing suits that damage our souls..."

Ascribing temporal or supernatural power to a statue of a human being?

Sounds like avodah zara.

[Ben]

On the one hand,I am uncomfortable with constant display of near nudity in shopping windows, especially in front of children. On the other hand this issue should be solved through education and not through taliban like treats, which Rabbi Cohen employs.

Just imagine hew Rabbi Cohen would be offended had a secular authority demanded all shops in Mea Shearim to show pictures of bikini clad ladies in their windows or else they would be closed.

I share Rabbi Cohen's goal, but despise his methods. Employing threats is a slippery slope way to talibanism.

[mordecai]

Chicaga Samson:

The tzeducah box is about 24 inches long and 18 inches wide but it might be 18 inches long and 12 inches wide (at the smallest). Schneersons ugly puss is right there staring out at you. It is in the Shul itself so when you daven and look towards the Torah you can seek his sinister gaze.

[Yochanan Lavie]

"On the other hand this issue should be solved through education and not through taliban like treats..."

Such as Ayatollah Ice Cream?
Bin Laden Brownies?
Afterdinnerjad mints?

All OU certified.

[mordecai]

I will take the afterdinnerjad mints

[Chicago Samson]

Judging by the physical dimensions of the Tsedakah box, it appears that the Chabad rabbis in the Miami shul have cleverly circumvented the problem of having the Rebbe's picture near the ark. What do you think?

Do they yell out the "Yechi" prayer?

[mordecai]

Chicago Samson:

The Karaites encouraged each of us to interpet the Tanach ourselves. And the commandment that tyou shall have no other gods before you means just that. Period. End conversation. Regardless of the size of the box. That is my view.