GUEST POST: A View From Crown Heights

By…

…Yaacov Behrman.

The American financial system is going down the drain. In the last few days alone, tens of thousands of Americans citizen have lost their jobs and thousands of Americans haven't been paid in weeks. Millions of Americans are in danger of losing their homes and hundreds of thousands of others don't have the money to pay for heating and gas. General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Corp. and Chrysler LLC are in danger of going bankrupt. The potential domino effect is colossal and debates rage daily on Capitol Hill on whether the government should spend twenty five billion dollars to bail out these failing companies.

At the same time that the country is falling apart economically, we have the tragic comedy of a group of people celebrating the demise of an entire town. These people claim to represent human rights and civil liberties. They ride like knights on white horses always coming just in time to save the abused and harassed. It seems rather ironic that these so called champions of human rights have so far succeeded in putting thousands of people out of jobs, leaving them without the basic necessities of food or water.

The Downfall of Agri will do more than just destroy the town of Postville. The chain effect from such a large kosher company closing is enormous. Dozens of butcher shops, groceries and restaurants across the country will be forced out of business leaving hundreds jobless.

Whether the Rubashkins are guilty or innocent is irrelevant to the larger picture. The people of Postville, the restaurant and grocery owners across the country are innocent. The thousands workers who are going to lose their jobs are without doubt innocent! The farmers who have no one to sell their cows to are innocent.

Furthermore, if the plant closes, the price of meat will skyrocket. All the struggling Jews who have a hard time purchasing meat even with the currents prices will no longer be able to afford meat. Many small Jewish communities will no longer have luxury of buying kosher meat in their local stores. The people of these small communities will have to drive hours just to purchase kosher meat. What wrong have these people done?

Legitimate investors have come forth to buy the company. The federal government has to understand that Postville must be saved at all costs. It is essential not just to Postville but to the entire American Jewish community. Everything in the power of the law has to be done to make it easier for the buyers to purchase the company. And all those who try to sabotage the sale should be held accountable.

This will also be the ultimate test as to the true agenda of all those who are advocating the closing of the plant. Will they stand behind the new owners? Or will they find a new reason to fight them?

May Hashem bless the people of Postville with success and happiness

Comments

[sempem]

Shmarya,

Thanks for publishing a dissenting view.

[Tanya]

Eh, a one sided view. Not that what is said is not true, but the effects, as written by Mr. Behrman, are not necessarily true. Where there is a vacuum, a force will be established that will fill it. Believe me, if people ate less meat they'd be better off anyhow, and besides that, I am 100% sure that an establishment will come into place that will fill the void. Boo hoo that the guildy ones are caught and punished. I like that justice be done. I like that people who have been getting away with allkinds of illegal and inconsiderate stuff are brought down. Let justice rein. Torah would agree, all our laws and halacha would agree, that new will outshine anything of the past. THings will get better, I believe that. I am ashamed that pious Jews have such shtick. Lets clean up our act, across the board, the Jewish board, and have pride in successful businesses established honestly. I want only to be proud of my people, Jewish people.

[avi]

Since when has Jews having access to meat, whenever and wherever, become a supreme Jewish concern. I guess this writer and others would like that as soon as a new Jewish community is established,even before a Mikvah or Shul is built, we need to round up some animals to the slaughtering line. If you want to understand the Zeigeist of America (I think personally this is starting to change thank god), its consumerism. The Texan proclaims "I want to have my gaz-guzzling truck whenever and where ever and the brooklyn heimish Jew proclaims, "I want my Fleish, whenever and where ever!" My brother attends a yeshiva summer camp in the Catskills. This past summer, a strict psak was given regarding taking showers during the 9 days. No showers allowed period! (Rav Ovadia just came out with a permissive psak regarding this issue). My brother, understanding the chumra culture of the camp was surprised upon entering the dining room the first night of the 9 days, that yummy meat could be seen as far as the eye could see. Of course they had arranged for a siyum (something that is criticized by almost all psokim). My brother approached the posek of the camp to try and understand the reasoning behing this. the response of the posek, "Dont worry about the meat, worry about the Churban!" I dont know about you, but doesn't that sound like classic Reform rhetoric? Apparently the brooklyn heimish Jew's desire for meat, is so strong that in can turn a chareidi posek into a Reform Rabbi lookalike! What happened to the Musar movement? What happened to chassidic ideas of controlling ones Ta'avas Achila? Here is a quote from the Kli Yakar on eating meat. (Devarim 12:20)
כי ירחיב ה' אלהיך את גבולך ואמרת אוכלה בשר. הורה שאין האדם הומה אחר התאות כ"א מתוך הרחבה יתירה, ואין ארי נוהם כ"א מתוך קופה של בשר לכך אמר כי ירחיב ה' את גבולך. וזה יביאך לידי הסרת מסוה הבושה מעל פניך עד שתאמר בפה מלא אוכלה בשר. ודומה זה קצת לפריקת עול מלכות שמים ולחקור איזהו מקומן של זבחים, והסבה לכל זה הוא כי ירחק ממך המקום אשר יבחר ה' כי כל הקרב הקרב ביותר אל מקדש ה' יש עליו מורא מלכות שמים ביותר כמ"ש ומקדשי תיראו ר"ל מן המקדש נמשך שיהיה עליך מורא מלכות שמים, אמנם כי ירחק ממך המקום גורם לך שרחוק ה' מכליותיך ע"כ כל היום תתאוה תאוה גם בוש לא תבוש מלומר אכלה בשר, הנני מתיר לך הדבר וזבחת מבקרך וגו' כאשר צויתיך. לא בכל עת כי אם לפרקים בעת התגברות התאוה וז"ש אך כאשר יאכל את הצבי ואת האיל כן תאכלנו. וכמו שנאמר כי יצוד ציד חיה או עוף. ואמרו רז"ל למדך תורה דרך ארץ שלא יאכל אדם בשר כי אם בהזמנה הזאת:
ביאור הדבר הוא, שאם ירגיל האדם את עצמו לאכול מן הבהמות המצויין אתו בבית שור או כשב או עז אז כל היום יתאוה תאוה וירגיל עצמו באכילתו דבר יום ביומו, אבל אם לא יאכל עד אשר יצוד ביערות ובמדברות ציד חיה או עוף שיש לו סכנה וטורח גדול לצודם אז תשקוט תאותו כי אין האכילה שוה בגודל הצער והטורח, כי לא לחנם אמר יצחק לעשו וצא השדה וצודה לי צידה. וכי לא היה לו בבית דבר הניצוד כבר ולמה חרד את כל החרדה הזאת לטלטלו במקומות הסכנה אלא שהיה מתנהג על פי הדרך ארץ אשר למדה התורה שלא יאכל בשר כי אם בהזמנה זאת ע"י צידה דווקא כדי שלא יהיה מורגל בו, לכך נאמר אך כאשר יאכל את הצבי ואת האיל כן תאכלנו. ר"ל אך בתנאי זה שלא יהיה מורגל בו ויאכלו כאשר יאכל את הצבי ואת האיל שמסתמא אינו מורגל בהם כי חיות הנה והם מחוסרי צידה ומחמת הטורח הוא ממעט באכילתם כך יאכל אפילו סתם בשר, וזה פירוש יקר ומיושב לשון אך יותר מפירושו של רש"י:
ולפי שמצינו, שבכל דבר הניצוד ממקומות ההפקר יש בו לחוש ביותר שלא יהיה דבר גזול, כי על כן הזהיר יצחק את עשיו שיביא לו מן ההפקר ולא מן הגזל לפי שאולי הניצוד היו לו בעלים וברח מהם, ע"כ נאמר כאן וזבחת מבקרך ומצאנך אשר נתן לך ה'. וכי ס"ד שיזבח מן אותן אשר לא נתן לו ה' אלא שר"ל שיאכל דווקא בהזמנה זאת כי יצוד ציד חיה או עוף ויש לחוש בו על הגזל כאמור, ע"כ אמר אשר נתן לך ה' שאפילו במצודתך לאפוקי הגזול אינו מאת ה' וע"ז אמר כאשר צויתיך. והזהרתיך על הגזל או הזהרתיך שלא תאכל בשר כי אם בהזמנה הזאת:

[Choni Davidowitz]

What wrong have these people done?
Why did they not make Aliyah 10,20,30, 40, 50, and 60 years ago.
I blame Chabad leaders for "not letting my people go"

If the Jews of America cannot see the signs now then it will be too late very soon.

[FirstGenerationBavarianAmerican]

After residents of New Orleans sought refuge in the Superdome to escape the flooding after hurricane Katrina, the place naturally was a mess because of the lack of water, sewage service, and ventilation. People were saying the place was destroyed. Well, they cleaned the place up without having to demolish it and build from scratch. So too, if Postville cannot immediately re-open, people will find other sources of supply. People are often overwhelmed when they see a big disaster.

Now, I would be outraged, too, if there were investors with enough cash on hand to buy the company, and pay off all creditors and back wages, but were blocked by government bureaucracy. I would write letters to my elected officials. All I need is for Mr. Behrman to give us the names of these legitimate investors to boltster the case I make to my elected officials.

[Isa]

In 1865 when the South surrendered can you imagine what that did to Southern Institutions that depended on slavery? Even elderly slaves were affected for the slave law said that a slave owner had to take care of elderly slaves when they could no longer work.
This Mr. Behrman could have written something similar in 1865 against the 'evil' Northern Forces that overthrew Southern Society based on Slavery. How can anything be justified if workers were being paid even LESS that the minimum wage for mind numbing difficult work let alone that they were being robbed of that pay because excessive rent, forced to pay for protective clothing etc and then they were getting treated as if they were some sort of a sub human creature!
When cows are walking around with half their guts on the floor and still mooing-do you think that is proper? It not only me that think that meat is Treif but there seems to be a large contingent of rabbis that think in the same way.

[yechiel]

such a valid point made by mr. berhman!
no one is thinking so far down the line as this article is pointing out.
yes! stop for a minute and think down the long financial chain, how many people will get affected, people of all race, gender & level in society.

the feds, and indeed everyone who has been fighting rubashkn, seems not to have the foresight of worrying who is getting affected by this.

now that the economy is down, take time to ponder over this amazing article

[Un-Orthodox and Unimpressed]

I was recently reminded of an old joke which sums up much of what has befallen the (allegedly) undoumented workers at Agri and as a result much of the town.

A young boyscout was arrested while trying to earn his good-conduct badge by helping an old lady cross a busy intersection.

How could such a thing happen in this wonderful country, you ask?

Simple. The old lady didn't want to cross the street.

[Un-Orthodox and Unimpressed]

In 1865 when the South surrendered can you imagine what that did to Southern Institutions that depended on slavery? Even elderly slaves were affected for the slave law said that a slave owner had to take care of elderly slaves when they could no longer work.
This Mr. Behrman could have written something similar in 1865 against the 'evil' Northern Forces that overthrew Southern Society based on Slavery. How can anything be justified if workers were being paid even LESS that the minimum wage for mind numbing difficult work let alone that they were being robbed of that pay because excessive rent, forced to pay for protective clothing etc and then they were getting treated as if they were some sort of a sub human creature!
When cows are walking around with half their guts on the floor and still mooing-do you think that is proper? It not only me that think that meat is Treif but there seems to be a large contingent of rabbis that think in the same way.

Posted by: Isa | November 24, 2008 at 06:01 AM

None of which pardons the North for the poor job they did in protecting the slaves they freed.

Sort of like invading a middle-east nation in which sectarian violance was kept in check by a brutal dictator who abused his own people as well as those of other clans but failing to plan for the day after.

Typical Chabad. Pretend you know about a topic and talk in complete generalities with exaggerated statistics backed up by no one. This ignoramus wouldn’t know a micro or a macro if it bit him on his useless ass. I bet he would defend Charles Manson if he was a Loubob. Probably say something like, “sure he killed all those people, but if you put him in jail think about all the morticians who will be out of a job.”

Economic principal sates that if there is a demand for the product someone will provide the product if they can make a reasonable profit doing so. If that were to happen the same amount of people would then be employed and there would be no long term effect on the economy (never mind the fact that Pottsville has no short term effect on the economy), and you would hopefully have a properly functioning industry. If prices were artificially lower due to the business practices of Agro (and that is a big IF), then prices will go back up to the equilibrium and we would lose the excess production. Losing excess production is a good thing for the economy, although there are short term costs, and something the government should be striving for economically, along with the social benefits of cleaning up this industry.

[Un-Orthodox and Unimpressed]

Why would you introduce the educated opinions expressed in your second paragraph with the pointless personal attacks in your first paragraph?

[Ahavah]

No, Postville does not need to be saved "at all costs." They had an economy before Agriprocessors came, and they will still have one after they are gone. In order to preserve the PRESENT economy WITH Agriprocessors, CHANGES have to be made: people have to be paid living wages, illegals and imported foreign workers need to be sent back wherever they came from, and American Citizens need to be hired. That means Agriprocessors will have to offer decent hiring bonuses and pay moving expenses along with the living wages and normal American benefits, because decent American people won't live in squalor in dorms and agree be charged exorbitant rates of rent. If Agriprocessors or any other company can't survive by treating people with dignity and fair wages, then they need to go OUT of business, because their business model is flawed.

And, btw, please..."nowhere to sell their cows?" Get real. These aren't humanely cared-for cows pasture-raised by local family farmers - they are the same old factory farmed agribusiness big-box cow-mills that are used by every other brand of inorganic beef produced in the country. There's no shortage of buyers. This guy apparently doesn't know anything about the beef business, on top of suggesting that Postville people are somehow "better off" being endangered and mistreated by a negligent and greedy factory. They'll only be better off when the conditions at the factory are completely within legal bounds and ethical ones.

[Barry]

It is sad to say but is nevertheless true. As bad as the collapse of Agri may be for Postville, there is still one thing worse and that is its continuing.

The business model of glatt kashrus adopted by the OU and franchised to Agri is broken beyond repair. An attempt should be made to sell the facilities to non Jews to operate as a non kosher plant. That may well be the end of the Jewish community in Postville however that will be needed if our reputation is restored.

[Un-Orthodox and Unimpressed]

Why do the undocumented workers "need to be sent back wherever they came from"???

Are the children of undocumented workers less hungry when they have no food to eat?

BTW, can you explain how any beef can be inorganic?

[Fleishike Kishke]

The U.S. economy is currently poor. Arresting illegal immigrants opens jobs for legal immigrants (or, gasp, natural born citizens) who will demand a better wage. I sympathize with the plight of Central Americans who do anything to get into the United States, but I also care about immigrants who were in the same situation and got here legally. Having gotten here, they deserve American (union) wages and working conditions.

Dozens of grocery stores will close? Why are these grocers’ profit margins on beef so high, that temporarily losing one product will cause them to go out of business? As for butcher shops … When the freeze comes to Florida, Orange Growers suffer. When the drought comes to Midwest, the wheat farmers suffer. Bird flu, hoof and mouth, Sholem and Aaron … these are the natural afflictions of the meat industry.

Will Postville’s new owners be accepted? If they treat their workers and animals humanely, they will be accepted. If not, they’ll be opposed.

The view from Crown Heights is myopic and exaggerated.

[JewishCynic]

Was Behrman a writer for "The Sopranos".
His argument is so ridiculous it boarders on satire.

"The federal government has to understand that Postville must be saved at all costs"
Ah lining up for a bailout, well what the heck everybody else is doing it.

"May Hashem bless the people of Postville with success and happiness "
Behrman, did you send a check to the food pantry?

[C-G]

In Mr. Behrman's world, burglars would go free so that pawn shop owners could stay in business.

[Norm]

If there are legitimate investors ready to buy for cash and Frist Bank either cnsents or is paid in full they will be able to buy. It's not up to Firt Bank to ensure that this scam goes on.

[Anon # 2]

Many commenters’s here disagreed with Behrman saying:

"Economic principal sates that if there is a demand for the product someone will provide the product if they can make a reasonable profit doing so."

----

In that case, then why bailout GM, Ford and Chrysler?

Let them al, DIE and have no worry because:

"Economic principal sates that if there is a demand for the product someone will provide the product if they can make a reasonable profit doing so."

As the "Tanya" post said:

"Where there is a vacuum, a force will be established that will fill it"

[Yochanan Lavie]

Good to hear from OG's such as Fleishike and C-G.

[Fleishike Kishke]

The Automotive industry affects 1-in-10 American workers. Postville Glatt … not as many. Also, this is CHABAD’s beloved Bush Administration doing these bailouts. CHABAD - - - the staunchest of GWB’s 13%.

I’m not opposed to corporate bailouts … so long as they’re coupled with minimum-wage pay for all executives until the companies turn a profit.

Hey, Yochanan. I’m not really back here … Just passing through.

[Bruce]

Tanya- Maybe i don't want to eat less meat. Fire up the grills boys,Let's EAT!!!!

[Bruce]

Tanya- Can't i also be proud of my people? "My WHITE people". Oh i forgot, I was told by some Liberal that there is no such thing as white people. I'm soooo sorry. I'm a racist for asking such a question.

[Boo]

Behrman is correct! It took years to build Postville and it will take years to rebuild anything similar. The supply will eventually come but it might years for that to happen.

[StillNotShmarya]

Jewish community plans discussion on ethics, kashrut
By LYNDA WADDINGTON 11/24/08 1:40 PM
Representatives from at least four Jewish organizations have scheduled a public discussion on the connection between ethical work practices and kashrut (Jewish dietary laws).

The discussion, which has been an especially hot-button topic in Jewish communities since the May 12 immigration raid at kosher meatpacking plant Agriprocessors, seeks to determine if, outside of specific religious laws regarding the actual slaughter and inspection of meat, kashrut is an overall matter of religious obligation. For instance, if it is believed that the workers in Agriprocessors were treated unethically, does that impact the kashrut of the meat the company produced?

Those scheduled to speak at the forum are:

Rabbi Ave Shafran, director of public affairs for Agudath Israel of America
Rabbi Menachem Genack, chief executive and Rabbinic administrator for the Orthodox Union Kashrut Division
Rabbi Basil Herring, executive vice president for the Rabbinical Council of America
Shmuly Yanklowitz, co-founder and director of Uri L’Tzedek, a grassroots social justice organization
The forum will take place Dec. 9 in New York City on the campus of Yeshiva University

Tanya- Maybe i don't want to eat less meat. Fire up the grills boys,Let's EAT!!!!

Posted by: Bruce | November 24, 2008 at 01:43 PM

Tanya- Can't i also be proud of my people? "My WHITE people". Oh i forgot, I was told by some Liberal that there is no such thing as white people. I'm soooo sorry. I'm a racist for asking such a question.

Have a great time at your next Aryan Nations barbeque, then.

[Un-Orthodox and Unimpressed]

I'm distressed to see the total disregard by some posters for the plight of the undocumented workers. If they are willing to work what right does anyone hae to give preferential treatment to American workers?

By your logic Natie Amerians should be entightled to your job before you if they are qualified and willing to work. I don't see you seeking the displaement of European Americans in favor of Native Americans. It is therefore extreme racism and bigotry on your part to demand that undocumented workers move to the back of the line to allow European Americans to take over the front of the line.

[Tanya]

Tonight, MOnday the 24th, on Channel 2 at 11pm, is a newspiece, which I have mixed feelings about in that it is on secular channel TV, about the "Ultra Orthodox", who cheat on their spouses and have affairs and "swing". OMG, this stuff is hitting the mass media secular TV. Its a bit scarey. True, but I don't like to see it on TV Channel 2 like that. Anti-semites will love it. It really rubs me. On one hand, I'm glad that these sleazy ones be exposed, but I don't like it exposed on secular TV, can you imagine?? Off topic, but yet on topic.

Kudos to Mr. Behrman.
American law believes that one is "innocent until proven guilty". Although one may get arrested, the burden of proof for a warrant is not proof of guilt. It is not even enough for a trial. As well, any punishment that is imposed upon the guilty, whether it be punitive or not, it is in relation to the sin committed. Why do we still complain about Yonatan Pollard? Is it not because when compared to others, we feel his sentence was too harsh? it surely isn't because we don't believe he broke the law - he addmitted?!
When compared to others who have been convicted of similar crimes, the Rubashkins seem to be treated harshly. I speak not merely of the possible jail time. just being paraded around in chains and cuffs is too much to look at. was ken lay is cuffs? was jeff skilling in cuffs? was denise kozlowski in cuffs? how about the adelphia guys?
So, it is quite unsettling that so many Jews are prancing around and vocally supporting the arrest of Mr. Rubashkin.
BTW - taken as a whole, who would you rather be a part of, the american jews like abramoff and milken or the PETA advicates that parade down public streets nakedly, and throw flour at innocent shoppers in coats and?!

[Mystified Kid]

I think what Behrman wants is

justice for "US" the people, he doesn’t give a damn if the leaders of this plant are right or wrong, true they did some sick things, and SHOULD BE PUNSIHED!

All he is saying is; Think out of the box!

Jews will not have meat till the vacuum fills,

They took years to make Postville,

Making Postville or any type of community like this requires tremendous work, chillul hashem, permits, non religious getting used to Chassidic way of life as outlined in the book "Postville"

Unless they build on these ruins,

Which will still be hard, especially with all the bad press, extra eyes, hatred etc?

We will rebuild stronger and hopefully better and more humane then before,

But I truly feel this whole story and some nice penalties will do the trick, and save us all the interim pain,

Think about 'ALL THE JEWISH FAMILYS' people that will suffer from this whole situation,

Meat IS IMPORTANT; it is a staple of Jewish communities, cholent, chicken, meat,

We have so many holidays where we are commanded to have meat; at this time of crisis it will be very hard for Jewish people,

We are so crazy about peace, not having capital punishment, CHANGE 08!! Going about things differently, not just killing the person, speaking about it, fixing it, sending him to psychologists, community service,

The truth is a nice punishment will teach the owners a lesson! Let them feel the pain these poor innocent people felt, let justice reign,

But leave the institution alone; leave the community, the innocent consumers suffering from this,

Even Israel doesn’t just blow up cities with bad people, b/c sooooo many innocent civilians will be hurt!

We civilians are getting hurt,

And you closed minded fools, don’t care b/c you have the money to pay premium dollar for meat, or less mehadrin!

well this isn’t just about 1 percent of the US population its about your brothers and sisters not having food on their shabbos table to have a bowl of chollent, to keep the commandment! Not b/c we are these crazy meat loving nation,

We chabad are Chassidim, meaning we do g-ds law mehader, look up shulchan oruch, it says to have oneg shabbos, buy meat etc. we should sell our things! Many already poor people in a crisis will do this b/c of their religious beliefs!

[C-G]

anonymous @ 6:55- how silly. Abramoff deserved what he got. So did Milliken. Count me out of their minyan, thanks.

Mystified- what did Yidden do before meat was plentiful and cheap? What you claim to be the "commandment" is revisionist history. My own great grandparents ate kasha, not cholent. Chicken was a rare treat. Beef was something they first tasted in America, and only rarely. A simple hot dog was always a feast for my great grandfather, something I, through my spoiled American perspective, took for granted.

Sorry, but I'm having trouble shedding tears over this "tragedy".

[FirstGenerationBavarianAmerican]

Hey, 06:55 PM:
I vividly rember Bernie Ebbers of MCI/Worldcom fame shown on TV walking into Federal Court in handcuffs.

[WoolSilkCotton]

+++We have so many holidays where we are commanded to have meat+++
Mystified Kid | November 24, 2008 at 07:15 PM

Where, exactly, in the Torah, are we commanded to have meat?

[Yochanan Lavie]

Where, exactly, in the Torah, are we commanded to have meat?

Posted by: WoolSilkCotton | November 24, 2008 at 09:15 PM

וְהָיוּ לְבָשָׂר אֶחָד

[C-G]

YL- I'm having trouble with the cholent connection there... Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

[Yochanan Lavie]

V'hayu l'basar echad. "They shall be as one flesh" (/humor).

[C-G]

Yes, I got it.

Actually, if you look at this "commandment" in entirety instead of cherry-picking what you like, you get:

"Rabbi Yehuda ben Beteira states: 'When the Temple was standing there was no joy without meat. Now that the Temple is no longer standing, there is no joy without wine.'"(Pesachim 109a)

He's talking about korbanot, people, not cholent.