City Spearheads Disaster Response?
That's what it claims. But what is the truth? Let's…
…see.
First, here's a piece making the claim that the city is actually behind relief efforts:
Postville Overwhelmed By Sudden Shutdown of Agriprocessors Plant
By Jens Manuel Krogstad, Waterloo-Cedar Falls Courier, Iowa
Nov. 23--POSTVILLE -- For months, residents said the town could survive most anything as long as its largest employer, Agriprocessors, survived.
So when the kosher meatpacking plant shuttered its doors and stopped paying workers last week without advance notice, a worst-case scenario was suddenly thrust on the community.
Volunteers from across Northeast Iowa scrambled to provide food, shelter and clothing to nearly 200 displaced workers. As they struggled to meet humanitarian needs, some familiar with the situation criticized city officials for stumbling in its response.
At a public meeting Friday heavily attended, leaders resolved to ask state elected officials for immediate assistance. The decision came exactly one week after workers found themselves suddenly broke with limited means to find a job or buy food.
"We can't wait until tomorrow. We've got to be doing stuff now. People need to know someone is working on their behalf," said Mary Klauke, rural community development coordinator for the Archdiocese of Dubuque.
Jeff Abbas, general manager of Postville's community radio station, said he begged the city for days to reinforce and organize the response. He said coordination among volunteer groups and individuals has been disjointed as they scramble to keep people warm and fed.
"We need someone in here with some emergency management experience," Abbas said.
The city, for its part, acted as soon as it became aware of the situation, said Darcy Radloff, Postville city clerk. Officials met with representatives from the lieutenant governor's office three times in the last 10 days to formulate a response plan, she added.
Officials are also working with the Iowa Department of Economic Development to apply for grants that pay utility bills and rent for a three-month period. If the grants come through, Radloff said, Northeast Iowa Community Action Corporation will help administer the funds.
"We hope to hear something in the next few days," she said. "We have been putting the wheels in motion here."
Steve Brackett, pastor at St. Paul Lutheran Church in Postville, said the scope and unusual nature of the emergency meant the city was unable to respond nimbly.
"If a tornado had struck Postville, we would have been inundated with services," he said.
Instead, the county's largest employer stopped paying its workers without warning.
The American Red Cross in Decorah housed and fed about 30 workers last weekend, but the agency acknowledged it was an unusual move because the situation did not involve a natural disaster.
"It's not a typical response for us.
Every response the city claims for itself is in fact something the state initiated without a request from the city. For example:
The city, for its part, acted as soon as it became aware of the situation, said Darcy Radloff, Postville city clerk. Officials met with representatives from the lieutenant governor's office three times in the last 10 days to formulate a response plan, she added.
Those meeting were initiated by the state.
The grants to cover and and housing? The city had nothing to do with these grants. They come directly from Des Moines and have been in the works for two weeks already. I wrote about them when discussing the foolishness of GAL Investment's disconnection power and water to tenants that had not payed rent, and I knew about them for several days before that.
All of Postville's relief efforts until now have been privately run and funded. And by that I mean the mayor and the town clerk not only had nothing to do with paying for these efforts – they did not even stop by to volunteer, and the city did not help in any way.
The mayor's only direct involvement was to make an emergency call as the sun set on Friday November 14 to announce the Jewish community was starving and had no food. His list of what had to be imported from outside Postville included flour, sugar, most staples, and dairy products..
One of the people the mayor' contacted was Jeff Abbas of Postville Radio.
Jeff announced the "starvation" on the air and called me asking for help with obtaining kosher food. I explained that everything on the mayor's list – except for dairy products – could be purchased locally in the supermarket (cans of corn, peas, green beens marked with a plain OU or OK; raw fruits and vegetables like potatoes, celery, carrots; pasta flour, sugar, etc., with an OU or OK, etc.) He then called volunteers in Postville.
Within 2 1/2 hours, Jeff's volunteers had collected 100 lbs or sugar, 100 lbs of flour, a large amount of potatoes, and more.
That food sat for a long time because the larger bags of sugar and flour had to be broken down into smaller packs. I told him not to do this himself and ti get help from the Jewish community to ensure they would not worry about the kosher status of the food.
The food was still waiting to be broken down mid-week.
As many of you know, I spent much of that Shabbat trying to arrange a shipment of halav yisrael diary products to Postville, while at the same time working with people nationally to put a relief plan in place.
(By the way, the kosher distributor here, when asked about availability of halav yisrael products and told of the need in Postville said, "I don't know what they're saying. I sent their regular order down Friday. Two pallets." the truck got to Postville Friday afternoon and was parked at the loading dock. I other words, there was no shortage.
The Postville Jewish community buys its cheese, butter, yogurt, etc., from Minneapolis. But it gets it milk directly from Chicago. Normally, Postville sends a truck to pick it up.
(Minneapolis could not supply halav yisrael milk because it did not have any in storage, and a new shipment wasn't due until Thursday.)
The point here is that the mayor did not try to get food, housing, heat, medical care or anything else for the hundreds of stranded workers. He and his staff did nothing to alleviate their plight.
No one in the Jewish community lost power and heat. No one was made homeless.
But the mayor's efforts, slight that they were, were directed exclusively to them.
You may also remember the rancher who donated sheep, turkeys and ducks. The Jewish community had slaughtered at his ranch before and he has friends within it. He wanted any trief animal along with the back half of every sheep to go to the food shelf and/or the volunteer soup kitchen run by Jeff Abbas and his fantastic crew of volunteers. (He also offered a couple of goats that, while kosher, he said the Jewish community would never eat. Those were to go directly to the soup kitchen and/or the food shelf.)
He passed on the offer directly, to two different rabbis in Postville. I posted it here, and Jeff Abbas and others doing relief work were notified.
But the Jewish community did not go to the ranch and slaughter any animals – strange behavior for starving people.
The point is not to rag on the Jewish community. Some members were certainly very close to having no food to eat, and the fear that gripped them after Sholom M. Rubashkin's second arrest that same day was palpable. One can easily see how they could have feared true hunger was imminent.
The point is, the town did not initiate any of the programs claimed in the above Courier piece. Every one of them was in the works many days before that meeting – and many days before the city thought to ask for them. Some of them were already being planned while the mayor was still on his elk hunting vacation in very early November.
The city had to ask the governor to declare Postville a disaster area. Without that request and declaration, many of these programs could not go into effect.
The state cannot simply take over a town's government at will. (Although, truth be told, I think Postville came within hours of legal action to make that happen.)
Some people think it best to let the city save face. It wants to claim it took strong, timely action? Let it, that line of reasoning goes. The main thing is that we now have help.
I sat on much of the information I have about the city's response in deference to these people, even though I disagree. I'm still sitting on some now.
But do not be fooled: If left to their own devices, the mayor and his administration would have left workers to freeze and starve.
Remember that, Postville, when next you cast your ballots.
Instead of trying to put blame on the city administration,lets think about who the real criminals are in this senario,first you have the owners of Agri and their top management exploiting people for personal gain and then you have illegals (who are not at all innocent in this )paying as much as 14,000 to enter the US illegally ,I don't care how illerate they are,they know right from wrong and even an animal knows what their name is,when they knowingly took false papers to change their name and drove cars that were bought illegally and with no proper papers, they broke the law.(stop catering to criminals) if our city government would have done this, they would have not been better than the last administration that catered to this behavior.Yes, feed the hungry but don't condone the illegal behavior that went on. The Jews and the former administration brought all this on.There are good people and families in Postville that also are struggling because of Agri,they didn't break the law,these are the people the city needs to help,but not the mess that Agri created,The city answers to the taxpayers of the county.
Posted by: | November 23, 2008 at 07:14 PM
Will the city obligate themselves if I loose my job and can't pay my bills? I totally agree with the above blog. I can see feeding them, but let them move on. How long are we going to do this for? What are they staying for? I have a pile of bills also do you want to help me? No wonder we have to declare Postville a diaster area. It's not like we are all rich in this area. Now we are starting the blame game. I think we all know who is to blame from the beginning, and we all do NOT have any sympathy for them! Quit giving false hopes and let these people move on........ free heat, rent, food ...maybe I should stand in line...............
Posted by: concerned for the Postville area | November 23, 2008 at 07:49 PM
I am very aware of the situation here in Postville and must tell all of you that the information that is listed in a lot of these news reports is incorrect. The relief effort, is exactly that, and effort to gain money for someone other than the people that need it. I personally tried to offer my help to multiple people but only after I was able to ensure they were not taking advantage of the things that I can offer. 90% of the people that are asking for help could have left a long time ago but failed to do so because they know the system of "Getting things for free". There are plenty there that need help but not the number Jeff Abbas says. He reports things in error and causes chaos amongst the community. This town is dealing with people that know the American system as well as how to take advantage of it. Jeff Abbas is creating much of this "to do" and he is just wanting to have something to talk about. There are a lot of people in this town that are willing to help but things are not free and we have all faced hard times before. Most of the people wanting help are not from Postville, so why don't they go back to where they come from? You might say they cant get back, but I know otherwise. I was offered a ride back to were I came from, as well as some others here in town, they refused and they also ask for help from the community. I worked at Agri and made more money than I had ever made before. Instead of spending it on nothing I saved it. Now I have my bills paid and depend on no one. That fool that was on Jeff's interview, was just that, a fool!! I know him personally! He didn't have to stay, he could have gone home for free with the company he came up here with but he knew people here would help him out. He knew that because people here dont understand the big city, soup kitchens, homeless shelters!
Posted by: John Clev | November 23, 2008 at 08:25 PM
Dear Mayor Penrod,
I am going to remind you of something. Remember when the representitve of the American Foods Group came to Postville to try and hire workers from our town? You tried to chase him away from our community. Looking back now, don't you think that was a stupid move you made? He tried to move workers from our town to Minnesota, a plant with much better workng conditions. That would have been very helpful to our town and all of the suffering citizens that conditions at Agri made. But sometimes I think that you don't have any vision because the city clerk said it was only 10 days ago that you asked to file for disaster relief, only after you were pushed from levels of governemt that were hirer than you are. Where were you all of this time? Where were you when Jeff at the radio station and his helpers were trying to save people from starvation and freezing conditions after their utility services were disconected??? Where are you now?? We never see you. I Just want to remind you of something Agri has created a lot of problems for itself, it's time you realize that fact. Realize that there are no more free trips to New York with special friends that are not able to go at this time due to their circumstances. Now we have to think about rebuilding our town. Just keep in mind that WE have to work TOGETHER!!!! No more secret meetings. No more secret calls. NO MORE SECRETS!!!! CONCERNED ABOUT THE FUTURE
Posted by: Concerned about the future | November 23, 2008 at 08:35 PM
To the above anonymous poster and Concerned for the Postville Area -
First and foremost, we are not talking about "illegals". The people who are suffering from all of this trouble now are ALL legal citizens of the US or able to work here without green cards as dictated by US law. They are the local residents who have worked at Agriprocessors since before the raid, the men and women who came here on their own in response to various ads or word of mouth and the employees who were brought here by the various staffing and/labor supply companies to work for Agriprocessors. Just so we're clear, they are ALL legal citizens of the US or able to work here without green cards as dictated by US law.
Those who came here on their own and in their own vehicles are, for the most part, gone. Those who are still here are here because they have no transportation to find work elsewhere or return home. These are the people who came here with high hopes based on false promises. They are people who were flown here from their home island, 80000 miles distant in the South Pacific.
The average wage in Palau is $2.50 per hour. Gas, food, utilities, etc on the island are all comparable to what we pay here. That kind of an hourly wage doesn't allow for much of a savings account. Suffice to say, the Palauans are stranded without money - nor is there much hope for receiving what they are owed.
A new start, higher wages and lots of overtime were the expectations of the employees recruited by the labor suppliers They were brought here by the companies that recruited them. These people came from Cleveland, Amarillo, Indianapolis, Knoxville and many other large cities where jobs are scarce. They too, are waiting for their last checks, which have yet to come from Agriprocessors.
I talk with these poor folks every day and believe me, if they could get the money they are owed, there is nothing they would like better to leave this nightmare behind.
You're absolutely right in complaining that the good citzens of Postville and the state of Iowa should not have to foot the bill. Agriprocessors is responsible for their being stranded here. All they have to do is pay their employees what they are owed. One has to believe and prepare for the fact that those payments could be a long way down the road.
I cannot ignore the need I see every minute of every day. I have seen tears of both joy and shame when people accept a bag of groceries from someone else because they have no money. The grocies and food, the conversation, the simple acknowledgement of sympathy and the willingness to help is giving some hope in an otherwise hopeless situation for the stranded.
If you truly believe these people should just be turned out on their own and hustled out of town because "we shouldn't have to support them", I would ask you to remember these words next Sunday as you sit in church -
"Withhold not good from them to whom it is due, when it is in the power of thine hand to do it. Say not unto thy neighbour, Go, and come again, and to morrow I will give; when thou hast it by thee."
Proverbs 3:27-28
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 23, 2008 at 08:53 PM
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/11/23/eveningnews/main4628688.shtml
Posted by: | November 23, 2008 at 08:57 PM
The problem is that this crap could have and should have been stoped years ago. The very first sign of any illegal aliens in Postville the proper authorities should have been contacted and had them removed.
But "NO NO NO" Postville HAD TO EMBRACE diversity because these were poor people just trying to get a piece of the american dream willing to do the jobs that the americans DON'T want to do. You deliberatly thumbed your noses at immigration policies DICTATED by Federal law. ANYBODY that helped to harbor these people in any way have in deed violated Federal law!!!
So Abbas, If the GOD fearing athorities actually upheld U.S. laws put in place to protect us from ourselves,how many Postville people that you personally know (be truthfull now) could be charged with a fellony?
So a good majority of the postville towns people broke the law and perpetuated the illegals all these years. The Rubashkins knew what they were doing. TJB. BUT POSTVILLE WAS BLIND under the veil of Multicultural diversication. "OH WHAT BEAUTIFULL WORDS" it makes me feel all touchy feely inside
Well of course no one else will go to jail unless they chimp out, but Postville is worse off now than before Aaron Rubashkins came driving up in his car one day in 1987.
All because Postville looked the other way. Some people got rich and many are suffering now. The Rubashkins brought in people who really did not belong here. They did it for greed and money. And after 20 years of criminal behavior Sholom tells the Judge "give me a fair shake" He needs a fair shake alright. A fair shake of someones fist!!! What he and his cabal has done for Postville is criminal.
Stop all of this crap, get the rifraf out pick up the peaces and move on. That's what we AMERICANS do. You have forgotten how we have got to where we are today. We did'nt stand around waiting for someone to hold our hand when we had trouble. We fixed it ourselves. That's what distinguishes us from the third world cultures. YOU CAN'T MIX DIFFERENT CULTURES TOGETHER AND EXPECT TO WALK DOWN THE ROAD SINGING KOOMBIA
Posted by: Bruce | November 24, 2008 at 12:09 AM
Bruce - I don't think you quite understand where I stand here. I do believe there have been a lot of people in this town who are and have been complicit in the things that happened at the plant before the raid.
What the group of volunteers that has formed over the last week is trying to do is keep the heat on and provide food for those who have been left here without money and no means to leave. Everything they are suffering from is a direct result of Agriprocessors failing to meet their financial obligations. As a result of their employees and the company who rents to their employees not being paid, we have many people in town (including some long-time residents) who are without the means to procure everyday necessities. That's who we are trying to help.
Granted, my count of those people may be incorrect, but I can tell you this - in the 8 days we have been assisting, we averaged 110 assistances with food per day.
"Stop all of this crap, get the rifraf out pick up the peaces and move on. That's what we AMERICANS do. You have forgotten how we have got to where we are today. We did'nt stand around waiting for someone to hold our hand when we had trouble. We fixed it ourselves. That's what distinguishes us from the third world cultures. YOU CAN'T MIX DIFFERENT CULTURES TOGETHER AND EXPECT TO WALK DOWN THE ROAD SINGING KOOMBIA"
If this is what being an American means to you, I fear for this country.
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 24, 2008 at 07:28 AM
reality check.
if the town us destitute why are people who could move on staying. is there false hope agri or a new company will rise that quick from the ashes. if yeshiva boys have no food why not learn elsewhere.
fron the jewish enron to the jewish katrina syndrome.
Posted by: concern jew 2 | November 24, 2008 at 12:07 PM
Jeff- you better fear for this country. look at all of the Americans that have lost their jobs. They are not standing around waiting for someone to hold their hand, or threatening to inflict bodily harm, No, not usually, we are civil and usually get help from family or have some resources and BRAINS to find another job and move on with our lives.
When Northern Engraving in Waukon shut down did Waukon declare a human disaster. NO. Because everyone obeyed the law and Northern engraving did not use the practice of enticing third worlders here so as to exploit them for their cheap help.
I understand where you stand. You DO have an emergency when someone threatens violence. You do have an emergency when someone is cold or starving But that happens day in day out in our country without any fanfare. But if it involves the third world immigrants- OH!!! STOP THE WORLD, we must prop these people up at all cost!!! BECAUSE WE ARE POSTVILLE- THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO THE WORLD!!!
I,ve lost jobs in the past,and been in an area where i could not find gainfull employment. I moved on before i had no resources to move on with.
Of cource the diehard touchy-feely liberals have a hard time understanding that type of concept.
So what i suggest for this big mess is to help these people the best you can-TO MOVE ON because if there are no jobs for them in Postville there are no jobs.
Well I Know!!! I just got a brilliant idea Jeff. You could start training One if the Hispanics to be a DJ and get some mexican beaner music and open up Postville's very first Latino Radio station.
Posted by: Bruce | November 24, 2008 at 12:42 PM
That is a very good point concern jew 2. Why do they stay, especially the Torah students. When people asked their Jewish neighbors if they were okay the answer was we are okay, and we do have food stamps. Many are on Medicaid so their children have health coverage. This could go on and on and on.
Posted by: State of Postville III | November 24, 2008 at 01:04 PM
MANY OF THEM HAVE MEDICAID??? WHAT THE HELL IS THIS. Medicaid is to be used for the infirm and the elderly, not children. And besides, these jews have been working in postville for the past twenty years. Didn't Rubashkin pay his own people. I know for a fact that these jews knew where all of the free aid was. Just like vermin do. One finds the aid then tells his buddies where the free stuff is then they all swarm down on it and clean it all up. Just look at all of the food pantrys and the free clinics-SUCKED DRY!!!!!!!!!!
No wonder my Mother is haveing such a hard time with Medicare and medicaid.
Posted by: Bruce | November 24, 2008 at 01:33 PM
Bruce,
I applaud you!! Will you please sign up for Mayor of Postville? It's about time people start talking the truth around here before ALL the natives leave...........
Posted by: concerned about the Postville area | November 24, 2008 at 02:55 PM
bruce
you must be the local real and true bigot.
anyone who equates any person as vermin is sick. I hope you are really the very small minority and maybe you live un a cave in northern idaho (no offense to idaho-just the white racists that live there)
Posted by: concern jew 2 | November 24, 2008 at 03:06 PM
Bruce - You still don't get it. The people we are dealing with here are ALL legal US Citizens.
When Northern Engraving shut down, it was carefully planned and orchestrated so the all the agencies were available for consultation; Iowa Workforce Dev, DHS, etc. These agencies were available for an extended period of time to their employees to ease the trauma of the closure.
One could even say they offered a helping to find these people other jobs and ways to get there.
The closure and non-payment surrounding Agriprocesses was unplanned, sudden and very traumatic.
And we already have an Hispanic DJ in place for a program on Friday nights. It has been running very successfully for several months. But, thanks for the suggestion.
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 24, 2008 at 03:23 PM
Jeff,I hate to tell you this, but we still have illegals here,they jut weren't caught in the raid and are still among the Postville people.I beleive the federal government needs to roll another bus into town and clean up the place.
Posted by: | November 24, 2008 at 03:52 PM
Jeff,
How many of these Jewish starving community members were drinking with Sholom after his first release? How many houses and farms have the Jewish community purchased? Funny how they would NEVER integrate with the community till now. Seems this community will eat up any pity story and be used as pawns for their benefit. Why doesn't Sholom open his house and his money bags up at Kosher Hill? It's bad enough we get sucked into all of this but know the churches (out of the goodness of their faith) have included surrounding towns to clean up our mess.
Posted by: concerned for the Postville area | November 24, 2008 at 04:40 PM
Bruce, I thought most of the people that thought as shallow as you do about people had already left Postville.
Posted by: Concerned for the future of Postville | November 24, 2008 at 06:55 PM
Anonymous 3:52PM -
I know we still have "illegals" here. But you know what? Almost all of them are here at the order of the government; our government. They have dropped them off at St. Bridget's regularly since the raid so they can testify in future trials.
Every time they "roll a bus in", they drop off a few more. If you have any complaints about how much that is costing the taxpayers, call Homeland Security.
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 24, 2008 at 08:59 PM
...almost forgot.
They also tell St. Bridget's to find them a place to live and support them because they will not allow them to work.
You can reach homeland Security at:
Citizen Line
* Operator Number: 202-282-8000
* Comment Line: 202-282-8495
Mailing Address
U.S. Department of Homeland Security
Washington, D.C. 20528
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 24, 2008 at 09:08 PM
is it ironic or what after reading about some of the problems caused by a few of the replacement workers hired since late May that in the Postville Herald's "character counts: students of the month" photos, 13 of the 21 elementary students were Hispanic, 4 of the 8 middle school students were also. Some of them are children of people wearing ankle bracelets. The man who sold fresh produce from his truck by Lawler and Tilden said in October, "Most of those people were just the nicest people.". - It was OUR United States CIA that in 1954 overthrew the democratically-elected president of Guatemala, plunging that country into the 36 year civil war with 200,000 deaths, 47,000 "disapeared", 1.5 milliion displaced. The Mayan Indians were especially targeted in this civil war. Most of the Guatemalans in Postville were of Mayan background from the Chiltaman---go region. - It was our country's well- meant NAFTA (North American Free Trade Allliance) which caused many in Mexico to no longer be able to make a living farming there. Yes, coming across the border was illegal but please understand these reasons behind it.
Posted by: | November 24, 2008 at 11:17 PM
Let me first start off by saying that racism is a sign of ignorance. I must also say that ignorance is blind. Until you have walked in someones shoes you cant possibly say they are deserving or un-deserving of help. This is in response to everyones post about arguing "To Help or Not to Help" Jeff, while I think that you have the best intentions, I also think that you have no idea what/who you are dealing with. The gentleman on your radio show only used the threat of violence to get a response out of people, he had no intention on doing anything. I personally know the gentleman that made the threats, his name is Paul, and he made threats that didn't hold water. He claims he is a convict because you led him to that, he has been convicted of DUI and Public intox, no threat to society! He played that to his advantage to scare people to get what he wants. He is harmless, trust me! I respect every persons opinion and would suggest all people argue the other side of their convictions with as much passion that they do of their own. I say this because this will allow you to open your mind to new ideas, debate does that. In that same statement I totally disagree with allowing someone to create chaos with threats, real or not! That does nothing but strike fear in people, and people that are ignorant and fearful will feel backed into a corner and will fight back. Jeff you should have known better than to let that man voice those threats, if you really thought those were threats then you should have felt a sense of duty to report it to the authorities. If anything of the threats were actually committed then you should feel guilty for just reporting it. Please realize that I appreciate free speech but when that free speech promotes ignorance and fear it is irresponsible. I have lived in a homeless shelter, and the only reason I picked up my life is because my family washed their hands of me. They gave me no more help or money and that is when I decided to grow up and be a man. Not all, but most of these people need that. Legal or Illegal doesn't matter, they need to move on. Not everyone needs our help, they just ask, most people that need help have to much pride to ask for it and can also show you through their own actions that they deserve it. Next time one of these people want a free room or food, ask them one thing "Will you give your time to help some other people as well" If they stand by your side and help others, then they deserve, if they say oh I have to do this or that, then let them hit rock bottom. Rock bottom is the only place they will learn to grow up!!! Trust Me. I can debate both sides of this argument but why do that when one side is clearly causing more chaos. Jeff, I think you have a kind heart, but neither you nor postville owes anything to these people!!! I wish it could be easy to say who deserves and who does not. Good Luck all!!!
Posted by: John Clev | November 25, 2008 at 05:50 PM
John Clev - One more time, and this is the last time.
I DID report it to the authorities, within minutes of recording it.
I did not lead him into telling me was an ex-con. He volunteered it.
I never aired the piece on KPVL...I repeat - I NEVER aired the piece on KPVL. That means it was not broadcast. Ever. Period.
The Allamakee County Sheriff deemed it a credible threat. So did a prominent member of the Jewish community in Postville. So did everyone else I played it for ON THE PHONE that morning. Argue with themm. I did exaxctly what I was supposed to do.
Oh yeah, just to be sure - I did report it to the authorities!
Posted by: Jeff Abbas | November 25, 2008 at 08:54 PM