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September 09, 2008

BREAKING! Rabbi Menachem Genack Clarifies OU Statement On Agriprocessors

I asked the OU's "CEO of Kosher Rabbi Menachem Genack…

… some detailed questions regarding Agriprocessors.

To be completely fair to Rabbi Genack, I'm posting the entire interview as an mp3 file so you can hear my questions and his answers in their proper context, completely unedited:









If it doesn't play, try clicking on this link:

Rabbi Genack 9-9-08-1.mp3

Comments

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Shmarya has a pleasant speaking voice--in addition to this blog, he should have his own radio show.

Luv the music

WOW!!!!!

What a lying SOB!!!!!!!!!

He said very clearly in both public and written statements, that if criminal charges were brought againat Agi, the OU would revoke it's supervision.

As we all know, the only thing that the OU cares about, is money.

What a Hillul HaShem!!!!!!

Make sure you don't get in legal trouble for recording that call without his knowledge! (I don't know what the laws are in your state and in NYS; but some jurisdictions require that both parties assent to the recording of a phone call.)

I was surprised he answered – I'd tried twice before and got his secretary – and for got to tell him. But it's legal here. Past that, it's good for him. He gets exactly what he said in context published – no mistakes.

In New York State as long as one party to a conversation is aware of the telephone call being recorded it is legal and is admissable in court.

Shmarya yasher koach!

Shmarya,
What's your take:Where is the company headed?
Reminds me a bit of todays very red stockmarket.Where is the bottom? Will they stay in business?
Sad.I feel for them.They have made mistakes, but still this is sad

I had the same reaction as Aryeh G. It seems to me that you should have informed him that you would be recording the conversation. On the other hand, I suppose he will assume it from now on.

Sage:

As Shmarya knows, I am no fan of Agriprocessors. However, the only things I have been able to find about the OU withdrawing supervision were in the context of a conviction. Here is one:

http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/108713.html

Rabbi Menachem Genack, head of the Orthodox Union’s kosher department, the largest kosher certifier of AgriProcessors, said the O.U. is awaiting the outcome of legal proceedings against the company before coming to any decision. If AgriProcessors is found guilty of criminal charges, he said, the O.U. will withdraw its kosher certification.

I would be interested in seeing a quote from the OU stating that they would withdraw supervision prior to someone being convicted of a crime.

Incorrect.

If he did not inform Genack about the recording, it's illegal.

I asked a Manhattan ADA about it.

Transcribe the call and post the transcript.

I am having trouble with the mp3 download. Can you redo it?

++If he did not inform Genack about the recording, it's illegal++

Wrong, Getzel- I mean, Anonymous.

http://www.pimall.com/nais/n.recordlaw.html

What Shmarya did was legal. Both Minnesota and NY permit one party consent to record a telephone conversation

--If he did not inform Genack about the recording, it's illegal.

I asked a Manhattan ADA about it.

Transcribe the call and post the transcript.--

New York is a one party consent state. See N.Y. Penal Law Section 250.05. In any case, it recording the conversation without telling Rabbi Genack seems underhanded to me.

Your recommendation about publishing a transcript is wrong too. If the recording were illegal, New York courts have found people liable for publishing transacripts of illegal recordings.

Wrong info is as staeted above a one party state.

Shmraya was calling from Minnesota. Also a one party state.

If I were to call Israel from NY and record a conversation it would be admissable in NY but not admissable in Israel.
Kacha Zeh

Glad you guys are so much smarter than an ADA.

Shmarya is allowed to make notes on the call.

Wrong, Getzel- I mean, Anonymous.

Don't you think they have better things to do than blog?

Like get ready for an indictment...

Notice they named others aside from the Rubashkins.

Next step, they get them to plea.

They testify against Rubashkin and...

Jail Time!

Shmarya, thanks for posting the call. I was amazed at how civilized it was. Great job.

Whatever the law, there was nothing underhand about recording the conversation and broadcasting it. The call was obviously journalistic in nature seeking to clarify a public statement just issued by the OU. It was therefore obvious that the conversation was 'on the record' and to be published. Someone of Rabbi Genack's experience would know that such calls are routinely recorded and his answers reflect this.

The call was legal, both in Minnesota and New York. There are other states where it would not have been legal.
Anonymous' ADA friend didn't understand the question, or didn't understand the law. Perhaps that person thought you meant a wiretap, or a third-party doing the recording.

When Rabbi Genack gets a call from Shmarya, he must know it's not a social call.

+++ Posted by: The Other DK | September 09, 2008 at 05:00 PM +++

DK,

You are correct.

But let's see if the OU keeps it's word on what it has agreed to. It's got a very poor record for doing this, at least for the last four years.

It's not improbable that, if the folks at Agri make a good faith effort, at least in the OU's eyes, to hire new management, that they will keep their Hechsher on if much more than two weeks have past, claiming this.

"Shmarya has a pleasant speaking voice--in addition to this blog, he should have his own radio show."

I agree, but he'll never be the "Voice of Postville" like our own Jeff Abbas!

Lanner is out of jail, the OU can put him in charge of Agri!
Figure they'll feel more comfortable with one of their "'ol boys" at the helm.

Sidebar: Ariel, Shmarya: patriarch Aaron Rubashkin is not a Meshicista according to Meshicistiim commenting here, and they don't seem hearbroken at latest developments:

http://www.chabad.info/index_old.php?url=article_en&id=12379

Shmaryahu

here's a death threat for you.
A certain retired shoichet read your site and became enraged about what he felt were your lies about rubashkin (although he has never worked there, nor has/had any connection to them) (he says the PETA videos were distorted--laypeople who saw the videos have no idea what they were really seeing). Anyway, he's planning on shechting YOU, when he finds you. He says your carcas will be found in an alleyway with a "shechita m'foras" (your neck will be sliced open from ear to ear with your trachea & esophagus hanging out). Don't worry it's painless (for you). Just get your affairs settled. He hopes that you have nobody behind to mourn your demise.

Hatzlocho in the world to came! (proabably gehinom for you, hahaha)

If I am ever prosecuted I want your friend the ADA to be the lead attorney.


http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/recording-phone-calls-and-conversations

Source Citzen Media Project


""New York Recording Law
Note: This page covers information specific to New York. For general information concerning the use of recording devices see the Recording Phone Calls, Conversations, Meetings and Hearings section of this guide.

New York Wiretapping Law
New York's wiretapping law is a "one-party consent" law. New York makes it a crime to record to record or eavesdrop on an in-person or telephone conversation unless one party to the conversation consents. N.Y. Penal Law §§ 250.00, 250.05. (link is to the entire code, you need to click on the Penal Code section, then choose Article 250 and locate the specific provisions). Thus, if you operate in New York, you may record a conversation or phone call if you are a party to the conversation or you get permission from one party to the conversation in advance. That said, if you intend to record conversations involving people located in more than one state, you should play it safe and get the consent of all parties.

Consult the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press's Can We Tape?: New York for more information on New York wiretapping law. "


Also for a detailed state by state listing see

http://www.callcorder.com/phone-recording-law-america.htm

A friend had a death threat left on his answering machine. In NY that is a felony.

Sage:

I have trouble imagining a scenario where I would want to purchase Agriprocessors products.

We don't eat much meat, and Empire products are readily available where I live. But even if they weren't, I would rather eat plain quinoa on yomtov than eat Agriprocessors products.

>>I agree, but he'll never be the "Voice of Postville" like our own Jeff Abbas!>>

Given that Chaim Abrams sits on the board of the radio station - I find it amazing that Jeff stays employed.

B"H

Sidebar: Ariel, Shmarya: patriarch Aaron Rubashkin is not a Meshicista according to Meshicistiim commenting here, and they don't seem hearbroken at latest developments:

http://www.chabad.info/index_old.php?url=article_en&id=12379


Posted by: Paul Freedman | September 09, 2008 at 07:31 PM


Dear Paul
I try not to divide people into "mashichistim vs anti-mashichistim'. At least not as far as claiming that so and so is being punished for his position on this issue.
The whole Rubashkin family is renown for their generosity and kindness (without regard to the recipients beliefs regarding the Moshiach campaign).
If they (or their subordinates) committed some violations against laws of the land may G-d Almighty have compassion on them and they serve no jail time and help them reform their business practices to the point of not being the target of prosecution by the government and attacks from the bloggers and the union.
All Jewish people are one body. If ones hand has an infection one doesn't gloat over that saying that it deserves it for not taking care of itself and amputates it...

Death threats on the internet are a Federal offense.

Sokolovsky is certainly an objective opinion on Meshichistim, being that he is an Elokist.

Chaim Abrams has resigned from the Board of KPVL radio. My guess is he has other things on his mind these days - like looking for a job.

Is Abrahams a Rubashkin son-in-law or some other relation?

I don't think so.

--Death threats on the internet are a Federal offense.--

But how seriously do you take a death threat from someone who can't even spell?

But how seriously do you take a death threat from someone who can't even spell?

Let the FBI judge. After all, it's related to an open federal investigation.

Shmarya,
Please get the police after that clown who left you a death threat. That CANNOT be tolerated. If you call the cops, they will be able to trace him.

Shmarya,
I hope that you follow up with appropriate federal authorities for the implied death threat in that previous posting.

Best wishes,

Jerome

I hope the a-hole who made the death threat shares a cell with Mr. Rubbishcan, and a 300 pound felon named Bubba makes them both his bitches.

Ariel Sokolovsky wrote:
"The whole Rubashkin family is renown for their generosity and kindness (without regard to the recipients beliefs regarding the Moshiach campaign).
If they (or their subordinates) committed some violations against laws of the land may G-d Almighty have compassion on them and they serve no jail time "

So if someone gives the rabbis etc. lots of money they should be let off the hook for any crimes they commit.
Hey we know that's how it works but is that the ideal we should be hoping for?

What does the Torah say about accepting gifts from someone whom you suspect may have obtained them via unethical or illegal means?

HI Ariel, no, it just occurred to me that there might be or had been an assumption (coming from different directions for different reasons) to "lump in" Aaron with beliefs he may not share.

I'm not close-enough to the situation culturally to hate the man or his family but I do think his labor policies (for human beings) are unethical and even if some may think a viable way to exploit suffering for profit--short sighted, pennywise and pound foolish.

And has placed him in a position where venal people are probably ripping him off blind.

I disagee with you about the union--I think it could have helped him in the long haul.

My personal belief is that anti-Lubavitch polemics vastly simplifies the varieties of belief and the context of Chabad practice--chabadinfo and the non chassidic frum websites/blogs cited by Shmarya show the non-monolithic "public opinion" in the traditionalist community vis a vis AgriP's policies and problems.


Please note, the "death threat" dude (an idiot, to be sure) said he was reporting something he has overheard – someone else make a death threat – not that he himself was making such a threat. Is he still braking the law? Is he legally responsible to report said death threat to the authorities? What if he does not believe the threat to be serious? Any lawyers here?

To MP: The slob who made the death threat clearly says at the beginning of his message "Here's a death threat for you". The idiot should be locked up. We cannot allow such threats to go unpunished.

why is all the media and "failed messiah" turning their heads to the kosher slaughterhouses? why are they simply ignoring the NON-kosher slaughterhouses??what do ya say to that?"failed messiah" wrote on their shirt that they are selling "I was slaughtered Glatt Kosher and all I got was this horribly painful hook in my throat" and you know what?they would do the same, if not WORSE, at the regular NON-kosher slaughterhouses. fine, become a vegetarian if you wish, but don't make a big fuss of the kosher slaughterhouses while pretending that the non-kosher ones are non-existent.think that over a while.

you know what?they would do the same, if not WORSE, at the regular NON-kosher slaughterhouses

That simply is not true.

don't make a big fuss of the kosher slaughterhouses while pretending that the non-kosher ones are non-existent.think that over a while.

I guess you'd throw most of Tanakh out because it's too critical of Jews.

Idiot.

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