BREAKING! Rabbis Walk Off Job At Agriprocessors, Cite Late Pay

Apparently the rabbis supervising Agriprocessors walked off the job this morning because they had not been paid.

Rabbi Sholom M. Rubashkin, Agriprocessors' VP (and Getzel's father) called an early lunch at 10:20 a.m.

Production…

…resumed at about 11:35 a.m. after Agriprocessors promised to pay the rabbis this evening.

(While this information is based on two different Postville sources., I still have not completely confirmed it. If you have any information regarding this, please post it in the comments section below. Thank you.)

Comments

[Archie Bunker]

Shmarya, don't you realize this is impossible?

Pesach Lerner & Dovid Eliezrie "know" that everyone at Agri is satisfied with their pay.

[WoolSIlkCotton]

Now the Rubashkins are trying to screw the rabbis; did Rubashkin accidently think they were from Mexico?

[steve]

He better pay them or they will start squealing. Weissmandel's $5,000 penalty doesn't mean anything if they're not getting paid.

[sage]

If this is true, Rubashkin must be in an incredible financial squeeze.

It's very fitting, however.

You are financially going under close to the time you will be arrested, charged, convicted and sent to prison.

A well deserved end to the most horrible Kashrus Scandal in Jewish History.

[state of the Jews]

I heard Sholom tried to offer the Rabbis a payment schedule, and they laughed at him. After receiving calls from reporters, Sholom stormed back to the sit-in and accussed the Rabbis of being a shonda for the Jewish People and promised them a check by the end of the day (didn't hear how much the checks would be for).
Interesting. Rubashkin could find a $100,000 for 20+ Rabbis to spend 3 hours visiting Postville, but couldn't find the money to pay his former workers the vacation money they are owed, or the the Rabbis, their salaries.

[steve]

5WPR, Lubicom and the various government "contacts" took all of the available funds.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

Shmarya, what exactly are you implying or adding by saying "(and Getzel's father)?"

[anon]

wow.. if this is true, they are not as smart as i thought they were.. the rabbi's are all they have. How else do you get millions of people to pay twice the normal price for meat when its publicly known that your cost structure can't be too bad given the illegal immigrants that work for you and the magnificent efficiency that is possible when you rip the troats our of living animals so you can begin to butcher them as quickly as possible.

Come on.. pay the Rabbi's.. someone has to jump u and down saying your food is kosher !

[Y. Aharon]

Wait a minute! The mashgichim are paid by the Rubashkins rather than their organizations such as the OU? If true, that casts a pall on their hashgacha. A major rationale for such organizations is to insulate the shochtim and mashgichim from total dependence on the owners. Furthermore, did the production stop when the rabbis went on strike? Some clarification is needed here.

Y. Aharon

[WoolSilkCotton]

There goes Getzel again! The best defense is a good offense. Allow me to clarify, dear Getzel. Your father is a convicted felon with a long rap sheet (available on-line). Prison beckons yet again. He is becoming unraveled.
The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. And that's you. Go ahead, take umbrage, feel offended! Just keep talking here, and to reporters; after all, you are so much more slick and clever than everyone else. You can outsmart anybody. Keep talking, give interviews.
What a putz. Even the Gotti family knows to keep their mouths shut when the heat is on.

[Y. Aharon]

My first post got lost. Let's try again.

Are you implying that the mashgichim are paid directly by the Rubashkins? I thought that a major rationale for certifying agencies was to insulate the shochtim and mashgichim from total dependence on the owners? Furthermore, did kosher production cease while the rabbis were on strike? Some clarification is needed.

Y. Aharon

[steve]

Y. Aharon,

Rise and shine! Welcome to wild and wacky world of kashrus in America, 2008.

[Jen]

Y - this is the norm. Mashgichim get paid directly. I'm assuming since it works like this in restaurants, it happens here too.

[hancock park]

Maybe Matisyahu can give the Rubashkins a loan.Oh I forgot, he isn't Lubavitch anymore. So Sorry!

[steve]

The mashgichim are paid by the Rubashkins rather than their organizations such as the OU?

LOL. The OU is not in business to pay, they are in business to collect. They sell the rights to their logo for a huge licensing fee. The kashrus organization is chaired by the notorious Dr. Steven Katz who was caught selling a truckload of treife meat back in 1985. The OU claims to be relying on the "hashgocho" of Weissmandel who is more of a salesman who gets paid an annual salary of $250K for landing lucrative accounts. Weissmandel instituted the $5,000 "muzzle" clause in every rabbis contract. Now, does anybody still think that Rubashkin products are "kosher"? These frauds have made a complete mockery out of kashrus, which was in a sad state even before they arrived on the scene.

[Lawrence M. Reisman]

Jen:

Not necessarily. When Chaimowitz was shechting in Minnesota, the Vaad LeMismeres paid the shochtim, bodkim, and mashgichim directly. The same arrangement exists in other places as well, but not frequently enough.

[Jason]

Woolsilkcotton: It gets confusing because of the similarities in names, but I think the Sholom Rubashkin mentioned here as VP of AgriProcessors (and father of Getzel) is a different person than Sholom Rubashkin, son of Moshe, son of Aaron, who has been convicted along with his father Moshe in the hazardous waste scheme. Moshe, of course, has served time previously for bank fraud and pled guilty to charges stemming from an assault on police officers and rioting and now faces jail time for the hazardous waste crimes.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not aware of criminal convictions (yet) for the Sholom Rubashkin, father of Getzel, who runs the Postville plant.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

The bigot is back, and he lies now too. My father is nothing of the sort, and you are probably guilty of slander at this point.

For all the self-righteous commenters here, I am not directly involved in that area, but I am pretty sure the Rabbis are paid through the certifiers. Sorry to rain on your parade.

[WoolSilkCotton]

There is another website I saw recently, previously not mentioned on failedmessiah, with a line-by-line detailed rap sheet for every Rubashkin. I will find it this evening and post it.

[Archie Bunker]

WoolSilkCotton,

It is not Getzel's father who has a criminal record, it is his uncle and first cousin.

[rebitzman]

++Your father is a convicted felon with a long rap sheet (available on-line).++

I see that several posters have already pointed out your error.

Fact check BEFORE going off next time - OK?

[State of Psotville]

Sorry to rain on your parade Getzel, but the rabbis are not paid by the certifier because they have paychecks cut by Agriprocessors and when they pick them up they have to sign for them with the receptionist.

[rebitzman]

++and you are probably guilty of slander at this point.++

Probably not - since slander is spoken and libel is written .

Oh....and like it or not, your father is a public figure, so the standard is a tad higher.

++I am pretty sure the Rabbis are paid through the certifiers. ++

I would sure as heck HOPE so.

[yidandahalf]

So what's the operation in Gordon like these days? We hear nothing. Have some of the Rubbishclan actually fled to Israel? Who and when?
My guess is few government types are taking their money these days; really do not think they can get anyone to take it. They will sell out sooner or later, and by later I mean in the near later.
As for Petzel Boy, I am confounded why anyone responds to him. He has this major problem of living up to expectations and I for one am sick of reading his f****ing therapy sessions.

[rebitzman]

++Sorry to rain on your parade Getzel, but the rabbis are not paid by the certifier because they have paychecks cut by Agriprocessors and when they pick them up they have to sign for them with the receptionist.++

Well....that makes no sense.

Even IF the Rubashkins ultimately pay these men (through certification fees) you can't have them do it OPENLY. Morit Ayin alone dictates that they at least TRY to make it appear that they (the certifiers) are independent.

Did NO ONE running that place EVER take a business class?

[Stephen Mendelsohn]

BS"D

JTA and the Forward now have stories confirming this.

[Jason]

Fresh fruit needs a hechsher? That's the first I ever heard of this.

http://www.fresnobee.com/170/story/809190.html

It took Zirkind months of research to determine whether a pluot -- a cross between a plum and an apricot -- could be certified kosher. The issue was whether the fruit's man-made origin was acceptable under Jewish law.

Zirkind determined that because the farmer was not Jewish, it could be deemed kosher.

That came as good news to Kingsburg Orchards, which received kosher certification for the tree fruit it ships across the country.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

State of Postville. You are a liar.

[Isa]

Dear Getzel:
Get out of there-it has no future. I think you would do very well going to Law school.
Last I heard there is a law school in the City of St. Paul, William Mitchel School of Law, I think.

[churbanboy]

What is sad about all of this is that there are no winners in this story-only losers. The workers loss is obvious. Agriprocessor's mangemnet will ultimately pay the price for their errors. The kosher consumer will lose because of what will happen to pricing. Religious establishment will lose because like the sages in the story of bar kamtza they turned a blind eye to injustice. And finally hashem himself will lose because his/her name is being dragged down through this chillul hashem.

[rebitzman]

++State of Postville. You are a liar.++

Perhaps "mistaken" would have been a better way to put it?

[Shmarya]

Shmarya, what exactly are you implying or adding by saying "(and Getzel's father)?"

Getzel, I'm not implying anything. It just explains to readers where you both fit.

[Shmarya]

Sorry to rain on your parade Getzel, but the rabbis are not paid by the certifier because they have paychecks cut by Agriprocessors and when they pick them up they have to sign for them with the receptionist.

This is true. Shochtim and mashgichim are paid by Agriprocessors. This type of arrangement is the industry norm.

[steve]

Question is, who hires these mashgichim? Are they hand picked by Rubashkin or by MMW? It doesn't make much of a difference as zeh neveila vezeh tereifa, but I'm still curious.

[State of Postville]

Sorry to say but I AM NOT A LIAR. I use to sit at the receptionist desk and hand the checks to the rabbis and have them sign for their checks. If you would like I would be more than happy to put a few of their names in the post if that would make you happy.

[Shmarya]

Both. But, in theory at least, MMW has to approve them.

[rebitzman]

++Sorry to say but I AM NOT A LIAR.++

Whay are you sorry?

[Anon]

--This is true. Shochtim and mashgichim are paid by Agriprocessors. This type of arrangement is the industry norm.--

My understanding is that some kashrut certifiers will hire and pay their shochtim and mashgichim directly, though of course that cost gets passed along to the company. In most instances the shochtim and mashgichim are paid directly by the company but the certifying agency has ultimate control over the hiring and firing of shochtim and mashgichim and they report primarily to the certifying agency. The exact sharing of controls between the company and certifying agency may vary from agency to agency.

[Anon]

I should add that this is a factual question that Getzel should be able to clarify quite easily.

[Archie Bunker]

http://iowaindependent.com/4303/worker-walk-out-at-agriprocessors-further-disrupts-production

According to two sources inside the plant, however, the walk-out was not an action limited to only the rabbis, but was completed by most, if not all, Jewish workers at the plant. The sources confirm that the action stemmed from compensation disputes, but claim that at least a portion of the Jewish employees there have not received compensation for four to six weeks.

[yidandahalf]

It sounds like the OU is getting ready to pull the plug.

[Archie Bunker]

http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110023.html

Agriprocessors is believed to be under severe financial stress from a combination of rising labor costs, high legal fees and reduced revenue.

[Archie Bunker]

Why is it sealed?

http://iowaindependent.com/4259/agriprocessors-supervisor-heads-to-court-on-new-conspiracy-charges

Authorities continue to search for a third supervisor, Hosam Amara. The indictment listing specific charges against Amara remains sealed.

[Archie Bunker]

http://www.democracynow.org/2008/8/20/iowa_town_turned_into_open_air

Clergyman Oudekirk says Rubashkin has now fired two thirds of the new Somali hires.

Then this:

PAUL OUDERKIRK: Well, you mentioned one thing that we have seen a lot firsthand, and that is the protection of the workers. We know that they are mistreated. A couple were beaten. They were asked to work faster when a line was going already so fast they could barely keep up to it.

When I was pastor here, I saw many cases of carpal tunnel, because they had heavy electronic knives that they had to swing over their heads to cut the legs of chickens and turkeys day after day.

We had the case of a young man whose—he was working on a machine. It got blocked. They shut it down. He reached in to unblock it, and his own foreman turned it on, and he lost a hand. And to this date, he doesn’t receive very much compensation from the plant. He’s seeking to get his just dues there.

But we saw people that were cut and others who were illegally charged for buying their own safety work clothes, when the plant should provide that. They were charged for washing. Different deductions were taken out of their checks that were never explained to them.

[Archie Bunker]

http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20081140&BRD=1817&PAG=461&dept_id=222087&rfi=6

They have become walking symbols of the raid.

Las mujeres con brazaletes. The women with bracelets.

They came from Guatemala and Mexico to work grueling 12- to 14-hour days in the Agriprocessors plant, frequently standing in boots in knee-deep water, their hands cramped and swollen from shifts salting chickens or loading meat onto trays. They earned $6.25 to $7.25 an hour, with 20-minute meal breaks and, they say, often no overtime pay.

May 12 changed all of that.

Now, about 20 to 25 women remain tethered to the bracelets - black electronic monitoring devices that dig into the skin of their right ankles, leaving dark bruises and painful cuts. Some women try without success to protect their flesh with makeshift bandages fashioned from bandanas and shorn socks.

And the women who happily embraced hard work are forced to subsist on donations from St. Bridget's and the local food pantry while they await court dates.

While they wait, they worry.

[Les]

Getzel Rubashkin should be ashamed of his deceitful statements, that he does not speak for the company, He is the Company!
His Father Sholom has 2 desks in his office and desk #2 at the right hand of his Father is occupied by non other than Getzel Rubashkin.
Getzel and Father Sholom discuss his post with each other every day.
Where else in a hectic and busy processing facility could Getzel find the undisturbed time to post all day long if not behind the closed doors of his fathers office with his approval.
I have silently read your eloguent post on numorous sites and have decided enough is enough.
You are Agriprocessors and share the office with the top dog.
Write your way out of that smart ass.

[rebitzman]

++Write your way out of that smart ass.++

Let me see if I can help him.

Do you have a shred of evidence that anything you wrote is true?

Frankly - I'd love to see it, because if it IS (and not just you "supposing") it would be quite damning.

[rebitzman]

++Clergyman Oudekirk says Rubashkin has now fired two thirds of the new Somali hires.++

Can't be true - Getzel himself says that they have had very little turnover since the raid.

[Archie Bunker]

http://www.gazetteonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080820/NEWS/27671553/1006/news

A former Agriprocessors Inc. supervisor pleaded guilty Wednesday to helping his employer hire illegal immigrants.

Juan Carlos Guerrero-Espinoza, 35, a former upper-level supervisor at the kosher meatpacking plant in Postville, pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court in Cedar Rapids to conspiracy to hire and aiding and abetting the hiring of illegal immigrants.

Guerrero-Espinoza admitted in court to hiring more than 10 workers knowing they were illegal immigrants. He was accused of telling employees he supervised on May 7 that they would be fired and immediately rehired by Agriprocessors, and that he knew they were undocumented immigrants.

Guerrero-Espinoza could be sentenced up to five years in prison on each charge.

Pete Deegan, assistant U.S. Attorney for Northern District, said the plea agreement asks for a four- or five-year sentence and two more years than the court would otherwise impose because of dismissed and uncharged criminal conduct.

Guerrero-Espinoza faces two other charges of aiding and abetting another in knowingly possessing, obtaining, accepting and receiving a resident alien card, knowing the card was unlawfully obtained, and knowingly aiding and abetting the transfer, possession and use of, without lawful authority a resident alien card assigned to another person.

[Archie Bunker]

One of the Hormels is a homosexual who Bill Clinton appointed ambassador to Luxembourg or somewhere.

http://www.austindailyherald.com/news/2008/aug/19/immigration-debate-hot/

“Minnesota is the fastest-growing illegal immigrant population in the U.S.,” moderator and Minuteman Ron Branstner told the audience.

Audience members questioned why Hormel Foods has never been raided for illegal immigrants, when other plants, like Agriprocessors in Postville, Iowa, have.

“Three times raids were scheduled, and every time, a directive straight from Washington, D.C. called that raid off,” Hendrycks claimed Mower County Sheriff Terese Amazi said.

Amazi was not available for comment.

Tully said that Minnesota is one of the biggest draws in the county for illegal immigrants.

“You have the highest benefits,” she said.

[the wise one]

Why do you people have to go and try badmouthing someone. Let's say they did something wrong they relized it by now and are most probably trying to correct it.what you are doing now is sick. And just realize if you people continue it could cause the rubashkins monetary damage ultimalely resulting in the firing of workers therby messing up other peoples lives. Please use brains before shooting off your mouth

[rebitzman]

++One of the Hormels is a homosexual who Bill Clinton appointed ambassador to Luxembourg or somewhere.++

And?

[Anonymous]

One of the Hormels is a homosexual who Bill Clinton appointed ambassador to Luxembourg or somewhere.

http://www.austindailyherald.com/news/2008/aug/19/immigration-debate-hot/

More irrelevant kaka drops out of Archie's mouth.

This is his sandbox.

Don't step on his turds.

His Depends are loose.

[WoolSilkCotton]

Meanwhile, the Rubashkins home is the party place to be in Crown Heights...
http://chnightlife.wordpress.com/page/3/
The NIGHTLIFE Lounge
Located at the Rubashkin residence 1349 President St. between Kingston and Brooklyn Ave.

[rebitzman]

++Meanwhile, the Rubashkins home is the party place to be in Crown Heights...++

Again....AND?

[Jake]

I have been following the Getzel posts.

clearly they contain information perhaps only known to insiders. Clearly the author is conversant wiht halachihc issues. Clearly the syntax,vocabulary and other linguistic markers are superb.

Does anyone know if it is in fact Getzel who is posting? Is there a ghost writer there?

For various reasons I suspect that the actual author of the posts even if the IP address is traced back to Potsville is a professional PR person.

[state of the Jews]

The focus of the scandal after May 12 was the mistreatment of workers and tzaar balai chayim. We then heard that Rubashkin was put on a cash basis by the cattle growers in the area because he was so far behind in cattle payments. The 3 hour Gilligan's Island tour of the YI Rabbis was a sign of desparation, not of how kosher the place has become - business has been substantially hurt. Today's revelation that Yiddin at Agri have not been paid for 6-8 weeks adds another piece to the puzzle.
And now one of the former supervisors is rumored to have changed his plea to include conspiracy with the plant owners to hire illegals - and we haven't even gotten to the bigger fish, not to mention the IRS.

So now the focus has shifted from poor, illiterate undocumented workers, to mashgichim and shochtim and how many checks they receive and from whom. Maybe this is where the focus should have been all along.

[yidandahalf]

AB, any news of Chaimowitz?
YL, anti-semantic, good to hear from you. BTW, haven't had the anti-semitic darts thrown at us lately from the Agri camp lately. Wonder why?

[yidandahalf]

Sparky, Les, and friends: Keep posting, we wait to hear from you so don't let us down.

[rebitzman]

++Does anyone know if it is in fact Getzel who is posting? ++

Yes

[Archie Bunker]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hormel

I see that one of the readers continues to be fascinated by my posts, especially the ones concerning fags.

Here is the background on James Hormel.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

Given the fact that I was asked not to continue posting about the plant, I will no longer regularly monitor this blog. The caliber of the conversation also seems to have dropped significantly.

I did not discuss any posts with anyone at all, ever, before posting. I appreciate the compliment from the guy who thinks I am a professional PR guy, but I am not. I am not Agriprocessors and I did not speak for them.

When I am working on a project for my father I use a desk in his office, and when I am doing production related work I use a desk in the sales/production offices. They are simply the available work spaces which allow me quick access to the people and information I need. I am rarely directly involved with my fathers work, and am unfortunately not his "right hand man."

State of Postville, as I mentioned, I am not familiar with the details of the arrangements, including distribution. Your story would not put you in the position to know anything but distribution, but you make statements regarding other details.

The fact that an Agriprocessors employee is the one who distributes the envelopes does not mean they are Agriprocessors checks. Agri obviously is the source of the money, but to my knowledge, they pay the certifier who then pays the Rabbi.

[Shmarya]

The fact that an Agriprocessors employee is the one who distributes the envelopes does not mean they are Agriprocessors checks. Agri obviously is the source of the money, but to my knowledge, they pay the certifier who then pays the Rabbi.

I know mashgichim who are still owed money from 20 years ago. The checks when they worked came from your father, not KAJ, the OU, etc.

Everyone I've spoken with familiar with Agriprocessors operation says the mashgichim and schochtim are paid by Agriprocessors.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

Besides for me, and I am a liar. And so is anyone who talks to me.

[Shmarya]

Besides for me, and I am a liar. And so is anyone who talks to me.

Perhaps the person who told you is wrong.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

I am basing my comments on observations I have made and comments I heard the Rabbis make to each other.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

Perhaps your information is wrong.

[Shmarya]

Perhaps your information is wrong.

Could be.

I don't think it is, though.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

I know it is.

[Shmarya]

We'll see.

[State of Postville]

The checks ARE cut by Agriprocessors as I also stuffed them in the envelopes.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

Was this before or after I ran around with a bunch of friends ordering around my elders like mere pheasants?

[Getzel Rubashkin]

I don't know the details of the technical arrangements, but Rabbis are paid by the certifiers who are paid by Agri, unless the Rabbis lie to each other when they are discussing these things.

[Getzel Rubashkin]

First you said you sat at the receptionist's desk, now you were in the HR dept stuffing checks into envelopes? Did you also sign the checks?

[State of Postville]

Here is a simple way to put what I did when I worked to Agri. I did alot of your families dirty work(changing dates on meat that was shipped to customers, helping in HR,answering the phones, etc.) By the way, you should have a talk with some of the current employees who work there now that have a habit of taking knives, scissors, etc that sell these items to people in Postville(Holly Bohr you should be ashamed of yourself).

[Taking the High Road]

I paid a visit last night to the new, HUGE, Kosher supermarket called Pomegranite, on Coney Island Ave. between K-L. And my God, I just couldn't get over how so many Jews paid absoulutely no attention to the highly inflated prices. They were shopping as if the world was coming to an end...Regular OUd milk was 1.99 but the New Square Cholov Yisroel was 2.99! So for the same milk you pay 1 dollar extra to get a few hebrew letters on you bottle, not for me!
http://www.onnyturf.com/blogs/view_post.php?&post_id=11865&tk=ac6c8662d27d2bce78dd&post_comment_request=y

[steve]

After the KAJ left, MMW was quoted as saying that he couldn't understand why they had to remove their hashgocho. After all, he claims, Mr. Rubashkin continues to pay mashgichim years after their retirement, out of loyalty. In other words, you don't have to do any physical kashrus supervision to get paid for your kashrus supervision. With MMW and the OU, it's licensing fees. With the retirees, it's hush money.