The Accidental Murderer

Rabbi Harry Maryles has written an homage to his dear friend Rabbi Morris Esformes. Rabbi Esformes is a large and frequent donor to charity, and supports many Orthodox Jewish causes worldwide, but especially in Chicago. Esformes lived for many years there, and was a principal of the Ida Crown Academy, Chicago's premier Orthodox Jewish day school. Rabbi Esformes received his rabbinic ordination, Harry notes, from Rabbi Ahron Soleveitchik.

Rabbi Morris Esformes is a despicable man, a nursing home robber baron whose homes have killed and endangered patients while Rabbi Esformes made off with money that should have been used for patient care and safety.

I have written about Rabbi Esformes several times over the years. A simple Google search turns up enough information to tell Rabbi Maryles what his dear friend Rabbi Esformes really does to make his money. But Harry did not do that Google search.

Residents in Rabbi Esformes homes died of heat stroke. Temperatures inside were found to be extraordinarily hot, in one case, the state found temperatures of at least 94º Fahrenheit. Rabbi Esformes housed unregistered sex offenders in his regular patient population and took no precautions to protect those vulnerable adults.

State regulators find Rabbi Esformes to be beyond the pale:

…Tammy Leonard, spokeswoman for the state health department, said while many facilities have deficiencies, Emerald Park's history is unique.

"We do have many facilities that don't have deficiencies," Leonard said. "Even those who do, don't have as many and at the severity that this facility has had. The history of this facility is unique, and that is the reason why we are taking these extraordinary measures. They have an egregious compliance history."

The state stepped up actions against Emerald Park because of its April 22 survey and past history.

"It had nothing to do with any outside pressure," Leonard said.

She said the state's main objective is residents' safety.

"If we see a situation where residents are imperiled, it is our job to fix it," Leonard said.

Lawyers for Emerald Park Health Care Center have until this afternoon to respond to the state health official's request that the Evergreen Park nursing home be placed in receivership and eventually closed.…

Rabbi Harry Mayles knows none of this. And he does not care. The same is true for hundreds of Orthodox rabbis worldwide, haredi and Modern Orthodox, who take money or benefit from Rabbi Morris Esformes.

Here's my question. Rabbi Esformes's took actions that killed elderly people. Did he intend to kill them? I don't think so. Still, they suffered and died as a result.

How can Jews take money from and honor a man whose actions killed innocents?

Yet they do. Orthodox rabbi after rabbi after rabbi line up to receive money from Rabbi Esformes. His name is placed on yeshiva and synagogue buildings worldwide.

These synagogues and yeshivas are built with the very lives of those elderly people, non-Jews, who wrongfully suffered and died under Rabbi Esformes substandard care.

Jews should have zero tolerance for this type of thing, but we do not. Like Harry Maryles, Jews are willfully blind to the truth of where the money that supports their Torah learning and institutions comes from.

When God calls in His accounts, I don't think he's going to look at all the Torah Harry Maryles learned in Orthodox institutions paid for by the blood of innocents and be happy. Instead, God will ask a simple series of questions – "When the weakest among you, the poor, sick elderly, were tortured and killed, you were silent. Why? You took money and praised the man who caused those wrongful deaths. Why? Is the blood of my creation meaningless to you?

You have no excuse, Harry, and neither do your fellow Orthodox rabbis. Say no to the money and take down your praise.

Here's Harry's piece in PDF for archival purposes:

Download emes_veemunah__morrie.pdf

UPDATE – A few minutes after posting this FailedMessiah readers left comments on Harry's blog proving Esformes is dirty. Harry edited or deleted those comments and then closed the comments to that post entirely. Here's what happened:

It's been reported that temperatures in facilities owned by Esformes are as high as 94 degrees F. I'm not a doctor, but I don't think that is a good way to make granny comfortable. Still and all, it may not matter, his facilities are filled with goyim.            Al Gore | 12.22.07 - 7:45 pm | #

More important though, why the obsession with Chicago being "the prototype"? That's why it's called the Windy City. Chicagoans love to toot their own horns.            Al Gore | 12.22.07 - 7:47 pm | #

>He has never been convicted of ANY wrong doing to the best of my knowledge... If he was not only would I know... the entire city would know. He sure was convicted Edited By Siteowner            Jake Goldberg | 12.22.07 - 9:29 pm | #

It's been reported that temperatures in facilities owned by Esformes are as high as 94 degrees F. As I said. The more succesful one becomes the more of a target one is. Rabbi Esformes has never been convicted or even indicted for any crimes of any kind. Not even finacial let alone mistreatment of patients. That one of his many homes was once 'caught' with e temperature setting that was too high can easily have been a one time event that was mishadled by an employee... or a mal functioning heating system... or any number of explanations. The same is true with any other such accusations. It's a pity that some people feel they have to knock him down with false information, half truths, rumor, and inuendo. If he were guilty of all the things his enemies have accused him of over the years, he would have been arrested, tried and convcted many times over. Never happened. But that doesn't stop some unscrupulous bloggers from bringing up every news story they ever read where alegactions about all kinds of nefarious deeds and wrong doings were reported, usually based on information by disgrunteled employees or realtives of patients out to make a buck through a law suit.            Harry Maryles | Homepage | 12.22.07 - 9:54 pm | #

He sure was convicted I went to that url (which has been deleted) and saw the so called conviction. The penalty was a fine. In an industry that is so over-regulated, that is as common as taking out the garbage. He has never been indicted or convicted of any criminal beahvior on any accusations that were made against him. He's wealthy target. He is going to be accused by people who ean to sue him. They usuyally need criminal convictions to base their suits on. I'm certainly not going to allow you or anyone else to besmirch the good name of Rabbi Esformes by allowing urls like the one you cited that will unfairly embarrass him. You wnat mudslinging? go find it somehwere else. The comment section on this thread is now closed            Harry Maryles | 12.22.07 - 10:20 pm | #

 

Rabbi Harry Maryles is a fraud. He is no more interested in the truth than he is in breaking his leg. Morrie's money is dirty, Harry, and so is the Torah it supports, stained and dripping with the blood of defenseless elderly people killed by his negligence and his thievery. That's your Torah, Harry, tattered and dripping in blood. Hope your God likes it.

Here is the entire comment thread from Harry's blog in PDF:

Download harry_maryles_morris_esformes_comments.pdf

Comments

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

Esformes is also very pro-family -- he's been married three times.

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

How can Jews take money from and honor a man whose actions killed innocents?

In bygone days, he would have to report to an Ir Miklat as proscribed by the Torah. Oh, and his rabbi would have to go with him.

These days, you can buy dispensation much like during the days of the Medieval Church.

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

"I envy his Olam Haba."

--Harry Maryles

94 degrees F in an old folks home?! I don't envy his Gehinnom.

[SJ]

Whenever an Orthodox Jew gets accused of something, his fellow orothdox Jews ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS take the side of the accused orthodox without looking at the situation OBJECTIVELY.

Proof: Look at the Israeli chief rabbinate. It is a complete joke. The current Ashkenaz chief rabbi has been accused of sexual harassment of women AND men, and the Sefardic chief rabbi has been involved in a kidnapping scandel, most likely sanctioned by him himself but he got out of it as far as the law is concerned and his son took the rap for it.

Did the orthodox jews look at the accusations against these chief rabbis objectively. No. Thank God for Haaretz.

[Ichabod Chrain]

Why do you have to attack R. Maryles? He wasn't responsible for the violations. Until I know differently I'll assume that he doesn't know, not that he doesn't care.

[Archie Bunker]

This is where UOJ comes in very handy. After a very public and hard hitting campaign by UOJ and his readers, Mirrer yeshiva kicked Leib Pinter out of the office and off their stationary.

This is not diabolical on their part. We are talking about a yeshiva where rabbis do not even read newspapers and had a hard believing that Pinter has been involved in mega-crimes that shook the ground all the way to the White House. Pinter was only there to benefit himself and used the yeshiva in the process as is well known.

UOJ is still trying trying to get Artscroll to recall Pinter's books. So far, Artscroll has only recalled books by Rabbi Paysach Krohn where he tried to sanitize his relative, the convicted child rapist Lipa Brenner of the Iggud "Harabbonim".

[Sephardiman]

Rabbi Esformes is a Tzadik who has helped spread and support Torah. You Shmarya, routinely stamp on the Torah. I guess we can chalk up your hostility to this great man as part of your animosity towards Sephardim and to Torah Jewry in general!

[chaptzemstinks@blogspot.com]

Esformes owns many properties all over the country. This is no excuse for patient deaths. However, the properties are managed by other people who are obviously not instructed to kill the patients.

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

Why do you have to attack R. Maryles? He wasn't responsible for the violations

True, Maryles is not responsible for the violations, but as a "rabbi" he should not give an imprimatur of respectability to him.

[Yossi]

In anyone thinks Esformes doesn't know about stuff like this they're deluded:

August 3, 2005 Southwest News-Herald — Oak Lawn, Burbank, Bridgeview, Edition

Release License Of Emerald Park Owners

By YVETTE PRESBERRY

Owners of the now-closed Emerald Park Health Care Center, 9125 S. Pulaski Road, Evergreen Park, have agreed to have their license suspended and later taken away as part of a settlement with the Illinois Department of Public Health.

State health officials said that Morris Esformes and Marvin and Doreen Mermelstein are banned from applying for nursing home licenses for at least two years.

The owners have to sell the Emerald Park building within nine months, and IDPH must approve of the new ownership.

The agreement comes a month after Esformes agreed to sell Emerald Park because of years of inefficient care to patients and other problems at the residential center.

IDPH officials had reprimanded Emerald Park’s owners after finding cases of residents’ lives at risk because of a lack of monitoring and/or improper acts.

One resident allegedly offered sex for favors, and was not noticed to be eight months pregnant or to be having a sexually transmitted disease.

Another patient with drinking problems reportedly died after being intoxicated and passing out.

Other residents complained of ill treatment from security guards, but the information was not assessed or followed up by the Emerald Park staff under state guidelines.

State Sen. Edward Maloney (D-18th) and state Rep. James Brosnahan (D-36th) tried to get Emerald Park shut down after media reports alerted the public that several state sex offenders lived in the facility.

Maloney and Brosnahan said that the occurrences at Emerald Park were putting patients and local residents at a risk for possible danger.

Attorney General Lisa Madigan stepped in and filed a lawsuit against the owners on behalf of IDPH to shut down Emerald Park, but both groups eventually created an agreement to avoid court.

Emerald Park was closed on June 3, and its residents have been moved by IDPH to other facilities.

Esformes and the Mermelsteins are banned from operating a nursing home where Emerald Park stands for 50 years, stated IDPH representatives.

This does not affect any other facilities the owners have in Illinois, said Tammy Leonard, IDPH spokeswoman.

The Mermelsteins have ownership in four other nursing homes in Chicago and Chicago Ridge.

Esformes has ownership in 18 nursing homes throughout Illinois, including Presidential Pavilion, 8001 S. Western Ave., a Chicago residential home that has also been circled by controversy and alleged crime for many years.

He could not be reached for comment.

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

Rabbi Esformes is a Tzadik who has helped spread and support Torah.

Could you ask the "tzadik" to turn on the A/C once in a while?

[Yossi]

A wee bit more Esformes fraud:

Health Care Fraud

James Desnick, Dr
Morris Esformes
Philip Esformes
Claudia Frank
Larkin Community Hospital
Jack Michel, Dr

Action Date: November 30, 2006
Location: Miami, FL

On November 30, 2006, the Justice Department announced that Larkin Community Hospital in Miami and its current and former owners, Dr. Jack Michel, Dr. James Desnick, Morris Esformes and Philip Esformes, have paid $15.4 million to settle federal and Florida civil health care fraud claims against them. Additionally, 34 related companies owned by the Esformes that were used to operate nine assisted living facilities are part of the settlement along with Claudia Pace, an employee of one of the Esformes-owned companies; and Frank Palacios, a long-time employee of the hospital. The settlement resolves the civil case entitled United States v. Jack Jacobo Michel, M.D., et al., which the government filed in 2004, alleging violations of the False Claims Act. The state of Florida joined the suit later that year. The government alleged that in 1997, Larkin, then owned by Desnick, paid kickbacks to physicians in return for patient admissions. The United States contended that the primary recipient of the kickbacks was Jack Michel, who was paid for patient admissions to Larkin by himself and his brother, Dr. George Michel. Jack Michel purchased Larkin in 1998. In 2000, Desnick was a party to a $14 million settlement with the United States for a similar kickback scheme from 1992 to 2000 at another facility he owned, Doctors Hospital of Hyde Park in Chicago. The United States also alleged in the Michel suit that from 1998 to 1999, Jack Michel, George Michel, Morris Esformes, Philip Esformes, Frank Palacios and Claudia Pace conspired to admit patients to Larkin for medically unnecessary treatment. The government asserted that some of these patients came from assisted living facilities owned and operated by Jack Michel, Morris Esformes and Philip Esformes.

[SJ]

Hey Sephardiman- go back to your middle eastern shit hole where people who critizise corruption in religion would GET FUCKING SHOT. You would like it there.

The Jewish blogosphere brings up legitimate critizisms of corruption in the Orthodox community and our RIGHT to do is protected by the first ammendment and article four of the United States constitution, so sephardiman, fuck you and you talibanistic ways. go sexually harass a five year old yeshiva boy because your holy rabbis don't allow you to date normally.

[Jake Goldberg]

>Why do you have to attack R. Maryles? He wasn't responsible for the violations. Until I know differently I'll assume that he doesn't know, not that he doesn't care.

I've posted various times on Harry's blog about his outrageous hypocrisy, where he praises "Morrie" to high heavens, but bashes the Spinka Rebbe two posts later. I posted various links which show that Morrie is no better than the Spinka, but so far, Harry hasn't let anything past moderation. Apparently, Harry loves to bash everyone else but when it comes to his own, he sweeps it under the carpet.

[Yochanan Lavie]

Where has Shmarya ever shown an animus towards Sephardim? In fact, he defends them when they're mistreated by Ashkenazi Chareidi rabbis.

[Jake Goldberg]

See Harry's lame response here:

http://www.haloscan.com/comments/hmaryles/1848245266864547720/?a=28834

[Nitl Nacht Seder]

This a list from EJF web site
http://www.eternaljewishfamily.org/rabbis/bateidinlist.htm

of rabbis who are on Tropper payola and/or affiliated with him. Watch the list as rabbis ask to be removed from that list and IYH the page would be no longer available.

Beis Din of Yerushalayim Rabbi Nachum Eisenstein 011-972-225-322047
Beis Din of Monsey Rabbi Pinchus Rabinowitz 845-425-1315
Beis Din of Philadelphia Rabbi Aharon Felder 215-745-2968
Beis Din Merkaz HaRabbanim Rabbi Moshe Soloveitchik 312-543-3945
Beis Din of Cleveland Rabbi Yisroel Grumer 216-321-5002
Beis Din of New York-Emek Halacha Rabbi Yisroel Dov Webster 718-236-9244
Beis Din of RCC- Los Angeles Rabbi Avraham Union 213-389-3382 ext 13
Beis Din of Milwaukee Rabbi Mendel Senderovic 414-234-8635
Beis Din of Montreal, Canada Rabbi Yonoson Binyomin Weiss 514-739-6363
Beis Din of Miami Rabbi Mendel Senderovic 414-234-8635
Beis Din of Houston Rabbi Yehoshua Wender 713-729-8870

The following batei din are also known to us to be using universally accepted standards:

Name Rabbi Telephone number

Beis Din of Cincinati Rabbi Zelig Scharfstein 513-731-4671
Beis Din of Lakewood Rabbi Dov Kahan 732-905-5922

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

See Harry's lame response here:

http://www.haloscan.com/comments/hmaryles/1848245266

He's now closed the comments section.

Must....gasp....suppress...gasp...the truth.

[Shmarya]

Esformes's homes have been cited repeatedly for flagrant and excessive violations of state and local health and safety codes and he he was implicated in and paied a very large fine for health care fraud, as Yossi notes in the comments above.

And Rabbi Harry Maryles refuses to see the truth.

People died because of your friend's behavior, Harry, and you defend him nonetheless.

Some God you bow down to.

[Ariel Sokolovsky]

B"H
I have no idea if and to what extent R. Esformes is personally responsible for things some of his companies have been punished for.
It probably depends how much control does he actually exercise over day to day operations of these nursing homes, if he personally was aware of any complaints from residents and failed to act or if the responsibility lays with mennagers with high degrees of independent authority and thus responsibility for each individual location they run.

Even if he is in fact personally guilty of these things I don't think Harry Maryles should be blamed for his post praising his good works.
If Rabbi Esformes would have been judged in a Jewish court (or a non Jewish one for that matter) Rabbi Maryles probably wouldn't be allowed to judge the case since he has been a close friend and admirer for a long time.
This situation would be comparable to judging a close relative or a person who gave you a bribe.
Thus it is surprising that Shmaryah would demand Harry's condmenatation of R. Esformes
.
I have also enjoyed Harry's post and comments.
It presents a more complete picture of a man who has been portrayed as evil on this blog and elsewhere.

PS. It is permitted to accept donations from people and companies doing things you disapprove of as long as it is clear to them that even though you accept their donation you still don't endorse their conduct.
Shavua Tov!

[Yosef ben Matitya]

SJ
while i find sephardiman's entry to be idiotic, i find your anti sefardi diatribe to be out of place and self serving to your hateful deranged mind.
may your rude curses, befall on you and on those who brought you up be they your teachers as well as your parents.
and keep your head in your butt's orifice where it rests best, animal.

[SJ]

Yosef ben Matitya- tell your Sephardi friends to stop infesting the modern democratic state of Israel with their theocratic political parties. You can tell you ashekaz hassidic friends that too.

[Archie Bunker]

Notice how SHmarya extends his legitimate beef with Esformes and Maryles to take a swipe at G-d himself. Shows what his motivations really are.

[Archie Bunker]

Ariel Sokolovsky doesn't have a leg to stand on. There is no halachic basis to take money that is ill gotten. There is even an explicit issur called mesyaye yedei ovrei aveirah besides the other ethical problems with it. Who does Ariel take money from at his Chabad house that he needs to put out this cacka justification?

There are not many yeshivos unfortunately who are careful in this regard. The yeshivos of Brisk in Israel are among the exceptions and have never accepted money from anyone known to be involved in improprieties.

[Archie Bunker]

Not to be overlooked is that Esformes is a former brother in law of Mordechai Tendler. Surprisingly, he continues to provide financial and moral support to Tendler even now in Tendler's dubious lawsuit against his former congregation.

[Jake Goldberg]

>Notice how SHmarya extends his legitimate beef with Esformes and Maryles to take a swipe at G-d himself.

Irrelevant. Shmarya correctllly pointed out Harry's hypocrisy.

[Archie Bunker]

Taking a swipe at G-d is "irrelevant"?

What topsy turvy world do you live in?

[Nigritude Ultramarine]

Some God you bow down to.

His name is Mammon.

[Jake Goldberg]

>Notice how SHmarya extends his legitimate beef with Esformes and Maryles to take a swipe at G-d himself.

Irrelevant. Shmarya correctly pointed out Harry's hypocrisy.

[Jake Goldberg]

Sorry for repeat.

>Taking a swipe at G-d is "irrelevant"?
>What topsy turvy world do you live in?

There's a million and one reasons to smack Shmarya on his behind. But he got it right on this one. Harry will be the first to scream about how the Gedolim sweep things under the carpet, yet he's just as guilty.

[Yosef ben Matitya]

"Yosef ben Matitya- tell your Sephardi friends to stop infesting the modern democratic state of Israel with their theocratic political parties."

your 'modern' state of israel, ain't 'modern' by any extent of imagination. though u seem to want others to believe it.
u have a lot of cleaning up to do, in order to render it constitutionally viable.
some of the problems are derived from the non separation of church (in our case synagogue) and state.
the state in it's present form is the creation of the shtetlach mentality by a chosid frame of mind turned dialectic-materialist (read socialist) fools. that's drifting from chassidim shoyteem to an often evil and discriminating replica of the pale of settlement run by jewish commissars and often devoid of culture -jewish or otherwise.
do not delude yourself in thinking otherwise.

[Jake Goldberg]

I just posted this on Harry's blog:

"Except when it comes to covering up for your dear friend Morrie. Sorry, but your wishy washy apologetics won't wash it this time. The case that was brought against him for making fraudelant claims was brought by the UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT (not by his competitor or opponent). To avoid a lengthy court case, he agreed to a 15 MILLION dollar settlement to repay all his fraudelant claims. He lost his license for his Emerald Park home due to the intolerable conditions there. Sex offenders lived in his nursing home. All this is via sources as reliable as anything else you post here. Yet, you sweep it all under the carpet and cover it up.

Will you have the courage to allow this criticism to go past moderation? Of course not. Only anti charedi/anti gedolim posts go through."

[Dave]

SJ, Do you know why a lot of Sephardim, even some not so religious, in Israel support Shas? Because they have been made to feel second rate both by the secular political parties such as Labour and even Likud (to an extent) and by the Ashkenazi Haredi parties. Why should they bother supporting a party that doesn't respect them? If Israeli politics was so wonderfully fair, why isn't there a Sephardic prime minister there by now- after 60 years, for crying out loud?

[Archie Bunker]

http://www.theawarenesscenter.org/Meystel_Yosef.html

This "frum" molester runs nursing homes for Esformes.

Meystel is also gabbai in Rabbi Eichenstein's shul. Eichenstein is the brother in law of the Novominsker Rebbe of the Agudah.

[SJ]

Wow now look who has a hateful deranged mind. According to Yosef ben Mullah Muhammad Omar Matitya, the state of Israel has only two types of people that it is full of: religious fundamentalist pieces of crap, and socailist pieces of crap.

Yosef, you are a dork, and you are one hateful and hypocritical motha fucka. I heard that the rent in Guantanamo Bay was cheap these days, you might want to consider taking up "residence" there.

>> may your rude curses, befall on you and on those who brought you up be they your teachers as well as your parents.

you definitely should consider moving to this certain "summer camp" in Guantanamo Bay, asshole. and the lack of separation of religion and state in Israel is because of the orthodox, both sefardi and ashkenaz.

Dave you also are a dumb ass. You might as well say, "waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! The United States is an evil country that is unfair to chinese people because we never had a chinese president even after two hundred years! waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!!!!"

As for why sephardim are mistreated in Israel, go speak to your askenaz haredi friends.

[Jake Goldberg]

Just posted this on harry's latest post:

Harry: The only question in my mind is how wide spread are teaching young people that it’s OK to be unethical in their financial dealings

me: Is admitting patients who don't really need medical care and then billing the government for it considered ethical? What about running a nursing home with total lack of care for its patients upto the point where it gets shut down and the owner loses his operating license, is that considered ethical in your book?

will Harry let it through moderation?

[Sephardiman]

Shmarya-

If you are so hell bent on convincing Jewish organizations not to take money from Rabbi Esformes, will you be good enough then to match, out of your own pocket, the contributions he has made to advance Torah education?

The Ben Ish Chai, z'l, would have put you in cherem for your attacks upon such a great Tzadik as Morrie Esformes!

Furthermore, as one who works in a Chicago area healthcare facility, with large numbers of Behavioral Health patients, I'm grateful to folks like Rav Esformes who keep these troubled individuals off our streets, something that is needed because of a failed policy, facilitated by well meaning mental advocates, of de-institutionalizing these patients. Without people like Morris Esformes our communities would be inudated with these clear burdens on the National Community, who are often criminally insane.

[Ariel Sokolovsky]

B"H
Ariel Sokolovsky doesn't have a leg to stand on. There is no halachic basis to take money that is ill gotten.

The substance of my statement comes from a letter from the Rebbe on this subject. I think I have even posted a link to it as a comment on another post on this blog.

There is even an explicit issur called mesyaye yedei ovrei aveirah

This prohibition you mention is violated by giving money to an abortion clinic or PETA for example not by taking a donation as long as it is clear to the donor that you don't approve of his actions.

besides the other ethical problems with it.
Who does Ariel take money from at his Chabad house that he needs to put out this cacka justification?

I don't have these type of donors, not that I am aware of anyway.
If someone like that wants to support my activities I wouldn't mind taking their money as long as it is clear to them that I don't endorse their actions.

There are not many yeshivos unfortunately who are careful in this regard. The yeshivos of Brisk in Israel are among the exceptions and have never accepted money from anyone known to be involved in improprieties.

Posted by: Archie Bunker | December 23, 2007 at 08:01 AM

I read a book about Brisker Rov where this is mentioned. It is clear from his explanation of this that it is his personal chumrah not a standard he demands from everyone else lest they would be considered halacha violators in his eyes.

To sum it up what I wrote in the previous post is a quote of the Lubavitcher Rebbe's words on this subject. I'm sure that if you do some research you can find the halachik sources for this.

[wondering]

sephardim man,lets just say a man is a murderer or an indirect opportunist of dead (indirectly killed people) people. can you answer the questions directly? does his other good deeds justify his evils?

and number two, is the money he makes as a result of the above in any way kosher money?

[wondering]

Ariel, the Lubavitcher Rebbe made it clear many times that bad money schleps good things with it and makes it bad as well. so I don't know what you are talking about.

The Lubavitcher Rebbe said (quoting Halacha) many times that according to the Torah there is no value whatsoever in a Mitzva that comes from an aveirah. If this mans entire money is made abuses of the elderly etc. how does anyone justify giving this guy a validation of his acts?

[Yosef ben Matitya]

selections from the sj's ealier profound, thought provoking persuasive scholarly (though somewhat repetitive) discourse:

....Yosef ben Mullah Muhammad Omar Matitya,
.....religious fundamentalist pieces of crap,
......and socailist pieces of crap.
...you are a dork,
.....hateful and hypocritical
.....motha fucka.
....the rent in Guantanamo Bay was cheap these days,
......you definitely should consider moving to .... in Guantanamo Bay,
......asshole.
.....Dave you also are a dumb ass.
......"waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!
..... waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!!!!"

of course sj cannot be accused of being religious.

[Yochanan Lavie]

Rather than wallow in identity politics and resentment, what Israel needs is a constitution that respects religion but doesn't allow for a theocracy, has district representation so politicians have to answer to constituents, and a higher threshold for election so fanatic special interest parties OF ALL STRIPES can't piss in the punchbowl. It also needs a better education system- one that is both practical for the 21st century and imbues Jewish-Zionist values w/o religious coercion (or anti-religious coercion).

Hitler, Jr. of Iran doens't care if you're Ashkenazi, Sephardi, or Chareidi, and if the socio-politico-economic atomosphere sucks, the best & the brightest will leave.

[Jake Goldberg]

Harry didn't let my comment go through, the coward that he is.

[Jake Goldberg]

>The Ben Ish Chai, z'l, would have put you in cherem for your attacks upon such a great Tzadik as Morrie Esformes!

I wonder what the Ben Ish Chai, z'l would have done to people who make fraudulant claims from the government and people who die from their carelessness.

[Jake Goldberg]

Another comment I left on Harry the Hypocrite's blog which probably won't make it through moderation:

>There are hundreds of stories like this

There are many stories about the Spinka Rebbe's generosity too. Therefore what? Does that make him not guilty too?

>and those who truly know about the generosity of this man also know how false any serious accusation made against him are.

Wow! What double speak! You (Harry) posted about that guy in Israel based on a news report, and when informed that the charges were dropped, you said show me the evidence (ie news report) that it was dropped.

I showed you a news report that Morrie was accused of conspiricy of billing the US government for fraudulent charges. That case was filed by the US government, no less.

Morrie LOST his operating license due to intolerable conditions in his Emerald Park nursing home. The onus is on you Harry to now show from a credible source that those charges aren't true.

Otherwise, you are guilty of having double standards.

[YS]

Without people like Morris Esformes our communities would be inudated with these clear burdens on the National Community, who are often criminally insane.
--------------------
Morris Esformes is no tzaddik, but indeed Shmarya might be eligible for a berth in an Esformes facility. One thing is for sure, it will be a lot hotter than 94F in the hole where Scotty ends up after he reaches the age of kareis. While there, he will have his choice of the Esformes Sefardic Minyan or the Spinka Shtibl!

[yona loriner]

such stupidity!

[Neo-Conservaguy]

"The Ben Ish Chai, z'l, would have put you in cherem for your attacks upon such a great Tzadik as Morrie Esformes!"

Such chutspa to claim to speak in his name!

[Ichabod Chrain]

Shmarya,

Didn't you once have a rule about comments that are abusive? There are quite a few on here.

BTW, the title of this thread is all wrong. You can't be an "accidental murderer". If you commit negligent homicide, it's manslaughter, not murder.

Also about the sex offenders thing, there's a difference between predatory sex offenses and plain old sex offenses. In some states if you're 17 and have sex with a 15 and a half year old, you're a sex offender and have to register for life, even if you've never done anything else. There a lot of people who have to register who aren't any more dangerous to old people than anyone else taken at random.

As far as accepting money, what if some of the money comes from ethical activities, and some is from unethical activities and you don't know which is which?

[Ichabod Chrain]

Shmarya,

Didn't you once have a rule about comments that are abusive? There are quite a few on here.

BTW, the title of this thread is all wrong. You can't be an "accidental murderer". If you commit negligent homicide, it's manslaughter, not murder.

Also about the sex offenders thing, there's a difference between predatory sex offenses and plain old sex offenses. In some states if you're 17 and have sex with a 15 and a half year old, you're a sex offender and have to register for life, even if you've never done anything else. There a lot of people who have to register who aren't any more dangerous to old people than anyone else taken at random.

As far as accepting money, what if some of the money comes from ethical activities, and some is from unethical activities and you don't know which is which?

[Shmarya]

As far as accepting money, what if some of the money comes from ethical activities, and some is from unethical activities and you don't know which is which?

You give the donor a bigger plaque?

[Ariel Sokolovsky]

B"H

Ariel, the Lubavitcher Rebbe made it clear many times that bad money schleps good things with it and makes it bad as well. so I don't know what you are talking about.

The Lubavitcher Rebbe said (quoting Halacha) many times that according to the Torah there is no value whatsoever in a Mitzva that comes from an aveirah. If this mans entire money is made abuses of the elderly etc. how does anyone justify giving this guy a validation of his acts?

Posted by: wondering | December 23, 2007 at 12:19 PM

non-theless there is a letter from the Rebbe in English in reply to a question if it is permitted to accept money derived from profits on unethical activities such as a finance company charging usurious rates of interest. He replies that as long as the donnor is not given an impression that you endorse his activities by accepting the money it is permited to accept them.
A copy ofthe letter is printed in one of the back issues of LChaim Weekly parsha booklet.
You can look for it by searching inside this site:
http://lchaimweekly.com

[Archie Bunker]

Oh come on now Sokolovsky, even if the Rebbe said that, how can you compare ribbis - that you can get around with a shtar heter - to outright thievery and worse? What other examples did the Rebbe give explicity besides usurious interest?

It's also a scandal that any makom Torah gives chashivus to unsavory people by putting their names on the building and other forms of kavod.

[formellyfrum]

It amazes me how many people will defend a crook a fraud evil man simply because he has a rabbi before his name or because he acts frum when it comes to ben adam lmakom and wears the malbeish but throws out everything when ben adam lechavero.

As for Pinter everybody knew he was a crook. And I remember mirrer yeshiva honoring a slum lord within a week after being released from jail. The Spinka rabbis father was involved with Bergman the infamous nurrsing
home owner.

Do the frum people care that there leaders are crooks? I guess not since they still flock to the shuls yeshivas that the crooks run. The frum either do not care, or do not want to know, and close their eyes, even when their children are in danger.

Question, with all the publicity about kolko
and how the powers to be in the yeshiva protected kolko instead of the children, HOW
MANY PARENTS PULLED THEIR CHILDREN FROM TORAH TEMEME IF ANY??

[Archie Bunker]

formellyfrum,

Eli Greenwald was seemingly the only mentch who pulled his kids out of YTT.

Who was honored by the yeshiva within a week of being released from jail? Are you sure you have the right yeshiva?

And can you point to any information on the web about the modern orthodox Bergman involved with a Rebbe?

[Formellyfrum]

formellyfrum,

Eli Greenwald was seemingly the only mentch who pulled his kids out of YTT.

"Who was honored by the yeshiva within a week of being released from jail? Are you sure you have the right yeshiva?"

I WAS IN MIRRER YESHIVA PART TIME AND WORKING PART TIME IN REAL ESTATE. SO I WAS AWARE ABOUT THESE THINGS. HE WAS PUT 30 DAYS IN JAIL BY A JUDGE. DO YOU REALLY WANT ME TO NAME NAMES?

And can you point to any information on the web about the modern orthodox Bergman involved with a Rebbe?

THIS WAS BERMAN FROM MANY MANY YEARS AGO. AFTER THAT, MANY OTHER NURSING HOMES WERE INVESTIGATED AND MANY FINED CLOSED ETC. SADLY MOST WERE JEWISH OWNED MAINLY FRUM JEWS. i WILL SEARCH THE WEB BUT THIS WAS ABOUT 20-30 YEARS AGO.

[Archie Bunker]

I give money to Mirrer yeshiva so I would really like to know which ex-con was honored so I can question them and reevaluate my support.

As far as te nursing homes, UOJ implies in old postings that Bergman and Weisz were operating at the same time - not necessarily together.

NAME IS Gross it was about 25 years ago
( man I am getting old)

i KNOW THIS SINCE I JUST BEGAN WORKING FOR ANOTHER FRUMIE (modern) WHO JUST TOOK OVER OWNERSHIP/MANAGEMENT OF SOME OF THOSE BUILDING.
afters a week or so I realized, the guy
i was working for (he always had to leave at 5pm to go to shiur) had no intention of fixing the building or giving heat. I quit
the next day that i realized this. Come to think of it I never got paid or did not care

I never said that bergman and a rabbi work/invested together they were just caught
up in the sweep/investigation.

Also, at that time I read an article I think the Jewish Press about all the nursing homes in NY being investigated all happened to be owned by Jews mainly frum ones.

The article asked why only nursing homes owned jews were prosecuted, and not goyiem? Was this because of antisemitism? So he did his own investigating and found out to his disappointment that the nursing homes owned and or managed by the Frum jews were
the worst from the lot and he could not find at that time any nursing home owned by non-jews to be that bad, they were well kept
and nice.

He was very disturbed and shocked, that only the nursing homes owned by frum jews were appalling, and did the freezer scam.

PS I do not look at these slum lord, nursing home owner to reflect the frum community. What disturbs me greatly, is the reaction, or none reaction of the frum community. Those crooks are not shunned and if a rabbie
is still looked at as a piler of society.

[Archie Bunker]

I have seen plenty of reports on crooked nursing home operators and slum lords who are not Jewish.

[Archie Bunker]

I don't understand how an honoree could have been released from jail a week before the dinner. There is a whole process in selecting him and reaching out to his circle for donations. Are you telling me the whole thing was arranged from his jail cell?

[Billy Goomgoom]

Esformes is an example of our community leadership, as is Perlow. It's sad, but true, fom the rabbis to the community lay leaders, we get the leaders we deserve. When was the last time you saw a yeshiva or day school honor an honorable man? They honor money and that is what our kids have learned. The collective community doesn't deserve better than the leadership we have because we haven't demanded more from those at the top. That is why the yeshivas chase the money and honor guys like Esformes. Because they can.

[LubabNoMore]

FYI:

Esformes was involved with "Arie" Crown (a day school), not "Ida" Crown (a high school).

[sildenafil citrate]

Well, As I returned from a Southern Hemisphere holiday, where temperatures were nearly 40 degrees C, I was shocked by the unusually cold weather in the UK. The winters in the UK are usually much milder than this as we all know, so what is going on with the weather? If you don’t know already, read on to find out and to read 10 top tips on driving safely during the snow period.

In most winters, especially in the past 20 years or so, winds reaching the UK normally came from the south-west. This meant the air had travelled over the relatively warm Atlantic and we got mild conditions in the UK. However, over the past three weeks the Atlantic air has been ‘blocked’ and cold air has been flowing down from the Arctic or the cold winter landmass of Europe (Met Office) of course.

[mail order viagra in uk]

I never said that bergman and a rabbi work/invested together they were just caught
up in the sweep/investigation.

[None]

http://www.thelakewoodscoop.com/news/2012/12/ribbon-cutting-ceremony-held-for-yeshivah-gym-donated-by-esformes-family.html

[None]

Do we not have any standards left in the Jewish world about from whom we take donations?